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Sealr or no-sealer

  • Thread starter Thread starter Giblet
  • Start date Start date
G

Giblet

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I'm gathering gaskets etc to tear the top end off my 81 1000G for the second time in a year. I once again have oil leaks around the base & head gaskets although not nearly as severe as last time. I'm still cleaning the oil off my left boot from that experience. The friend that "helped" me last time is a former Suzuki dealer and has ridden & worked on motorcycles for most of his 72+ years. He applied a sealer he swears he has used for years and I don't remember what it was and, as he can be a bit moody BUT always takes care of me any way, I don't want to ask. I don't want him knowing I am doing this. After doing this once, I'm confident I can git-r-done myself this time. I've retorqued everthing which helped but, still have weepage around the seams. I also didn't do new rings (had a good reason but it would take too long to explain).

Questions is, dry gaskets or some sort of sealer. Baby brother says dry, a friend (fellow GSR'r) says copper seal. I have Vesrah gaskets and am leaning toward "dry". I have new rings this time as well. I realize I'll probably get a plethorah of opinions but, hey! It wouldn't be any fun otherwise now would it? :D

PS To prevent confusion, I am refering specifically to the head and base gaskets.
 
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Here's what we do at the bike shop where I wrench: For paper gaskets a little Hylomar, for metal embossed gaskets or 'printed' silicone on paper/metal dry as can be. I'm not familiar with that particular brand of gasket or I could give more specific advice, but if your previous guru used a sealant it was likely Hylomar (blue in color) or Yama/Suzuki/Hondabond (gray). The *bond is usually used on gasketless surfaces like case halves while Hylomar works absolute wonders on paper/felt type gaskets. I've used it to great effect on gasket surfaces that had serious gouges from the misguided prying of shadetree mechanics with zero leakage. For the sake of thoroughness I would suggest making certain the gasket surfaces are flat within a couple thousandths. I use a thick machinist's rule and a feeler gauge or you can use plastigauge if you have some kicking around.

Hope this helps.
 
Yes, Plooker, it does help. Thats one more vote in the "dry" column. The stuff HE used appeared clear and brushed on. Like I said, he is 70+ (no offense intended) and I've known him since I was a kid (30+ years). There are times now and then, when he gives advice that just makes me wonder, if you know what I mean. Which is why, I'm doing this one all by my lonesome.

Plooker said:
Here's what we do at the bike shop where I wrench: For paper gaskets a little Hylomar, for metal embossed gaskets or 'printed' silicone on paper/metal dry as can be. I'm not familiar with that particular brand of gasket or I could give more specific advice, but if your previous guru used a sealant it was likely Hylomar (blue in color) or Yama/Suzuki/Hondabond (gray). Hope this helps.
Click to expand...

PS. I am refering specifically to the head and base gaskets.
 
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I always install those gaskets dry. In fact, I use brake cleaner on the surface and rub it down with scotchbrite to make sure to get all the old gasket and oil off. The scotchbrite will shed so make sure that crap gets cleaned off and doesn't go down into the bottom end. Smooth and degreased surface gets my vote.
 
Never put anything on a modern head gasket, make sure surfaces are clean & dry, replace all applicable O-rings (makes a huge difference in oil leaks) and make sure your head nut threads are clean and very lightly oiled, and don't forget the flange area. I shoot a little bit of motor oil in them then let them drain on a paper towel for a few. If you can't turn them down until they contact the head with your fingers you probably won't get the correct 'squeeze' on the gaskets. I personally like to use a beam-style torque wrench for head nuts as it shows you very plainly whether or not the fastener is torquing smoothly or in jumpy fashion. It's not a bad thing to listen to the advice of the old-timers, but be aware that science marches on and some techniques become obsolete. My father was a Suzuki mechanic in the early 80's and some of the advice he gave me on my GSs turned out to be more trouble than it was worth. I suggest a healthy dose of critical thinking for any advice you get, mine included. As a wise man once said, 'There's no such thing as an expert, make yourself the expert'.

EDIT:
Ed is exactly right, should have included that tidbit.
 
I would guess the stuff he used was/is called Gaskachinch. Commercial engine rebuilders used to use the stuff on just about everything. The grey "bond" stuff has pretty much replaced it today.Permatex sells it as "Motoseal #1 Grey gasket maker" at autoparts stores
 
Base gasket -nothing but OEM, install lightly oiled or dry
Headgasket ? its a crap shoot. Some never have problems, some do
 
For all the gaskets and o-rings from the base gasket on up, NEVER use anything except OEM. Vesrah has declined in quality, and I had several serious material failures on the last Vesrah gasket set I used. The cost difference is minor.

And they're installed dry, just as the manual says. If the surface is damaged, use Hylomar. Never use anything on the head gasket, and make sure the gasket and surfaces are dry. O-rings get a bit of an oil coating.
 
I recently bought an Athena gasket kit at the recommendation of GSR member Matchless. The GS1000G kit uses a MLS headgasket, which is why I bought it; two layers of soft metal coated with viton rubber - can't imagine it leaking. The other gaskets seem fine as well and they include a ton of different o-rings along with the gaskets. Ordered from partsnmore.com - $65 shipped. A GS1000 head gasket alone from Flat Out costs more than that.

Fingers crossed.
 
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