Temo guage reading high.....

[Duro5341]

Hey guys

You may remember my previous post about running lean. If not here it is..

http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?t=142441&highlight=HEATING

Anyways I had the shop dyno tune the carbs, it turns out the bike was running extremely rich around 10.5/1 AF ratio. So they modified the air box abit, and cut a few baffles out of the muffler. Now it's running around 13.5-14.0/1 alot better.

However my problem still remains, the bike runs great, lots of power through out the rev range, no pinging or bogging, however the temp guage reads extremely high. When crusing around it will be anywhere from 110-150 degree celcius. It seems to risehigher the longer I am on the bike, and cools off when sitting at a light with the clutch in.

I know my a/f ratio is bang on, so it's not running lean this was my biggest concern (don't want to blow holes in the pistons). And my voltage does not go over 14.5v when revved at 5000 and held there., and drops to 12.5-13.0 when idling with the high beam on.

I am wondering if the guage is not accurate?

Does anyone have any ideas?

Thanks
Duro

 

[posplayr]

Get one of these to verify the sensor; quite handy for such things. Provides two temp inputs. You could use this right on the bike; basically you need an independednt measure of sensor accuracy.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Fluke-52-Digita...CC%2BCRS%2BIA%2BUCI%2BSI%2BUS-BWR&otn=1&ps=33

 

[Steve]

A high reading could also be due to bad connections somewhere in the sensor line. Try cleaning them to see if anything changes.


By the way, this really caught my eye:

I had the shop dyno tune the carbs, ... So they modified the air box abit, and cut a few baffles out of the muffler.

You went to get the carbs tuned and they modified your airbox and muffler?

Please tell me where this shop is, so I know who NOT to let work on my bike.

That is ... unless your request on the work order was not "tune my carbs to run properly",
but was, instead, "do whatever it takes to get it to run right".

.

 

[gearhead13]

Your bike must be an EZ model, like mine. My oil temp guage just keeps rising up over 160C anything over 20C. When it gets that high I stop and let her cool down. I really dont know how accurate mine is
What do you do with this 'fluke' meter? does it screw into the spot where the old sensor is now or what??
I bought an oil filter cover with the two sensors still on it (off an EZ model) I was thinking of swapping sensors to see if the gauge shows different

 

[Duro5341]

By the way, this really caught my eye:

You went to get the carbs tuned and they modified your airbox and muffler?

Please tell me where this shop is, so I know who NOT to let work on my bike.

That is ... unless your request on the work order was not "tune my carbs to run properly",
but was, instead, "do whatever it takes to get it to run right".

.

They wanted to re-jet it, and I didn't have the $500 to start with the jetting, so they recommended that they will start be modifing the air box, and cut some baffles out to get me closer. And when they put it back on the dyno, it got them much closer than they thaught, and they were happier with this. The connection is clean at the sensor, it was cleaned during the last oil change

 

[Duro5341]

Your bike must be an EZ model, like mine. My oil temp guage just keeps rising up over 160C anything over 20C. When it gets that high I stop and let her cool down. I really dont know how accurate mine is
What do you do with this 'fluke' meter? does it screw into the spot where the old sensor is now or what??
I bought an oil filter cover with the two sensors still on it (off an EZ model) I was thinking of swapping sensors to see if the gauge shows different

Yes mine is an EZ model, and the guage just seems to be high. It still run great, and sounds smooth....just the guage needle makes me nervious Thats all.....

 

[Guest]

However my problem still remains, the bike runs great, lots of power through out the rev range, no pinging or bogging, however the temp guage reads extremely high. When crusing around it will be anywhere from 110-150 degree celcius. It seems to risehigher the longer I am on the bike, and cools off when sitting at a light with the clutch in.
I am wondering if the guage is not accurate? Thanks
Duro

In the linked post, you mentioned an inaccuracy of 10-15 C in the temp gauge readings. IMO, your bike is not running excessively hot. On my 1100, with prolonged running, with ambient at 25C or higher, I would see 110C, and slightly higher in a traffic jam situation . Adding an oil cooler brought the temps down a bit, and it now displays slightly above 100C, which is the ideal operating temp for these bikes, I believe. I don't think the temps you are seeing, are out of line for a 750, esp. with the gauge off by a bit, on the high side. The flip side of running a cooler up here, is that the bike tends to run cool in the fall/winter, making it hard to reach ideal oil temps.to boil off condensation.
Since the shop has verified the A/F ratio, and you aren't seeing significant blueing/burning at the header, I wouldn't worry about it. Run a quart of synthetic mixed in with the dyno oil ( I used to add Amsoil 0W-40), or even all synthetic, if it will ease your mind.
May I ask which shop did the dyno tuning for you & the charge? I have a set of RS flat slide carbs to throw on and might consider having it dyno-tuned, if the price isn't prohibitive.

Tony.

EDIT: Reno Bruce sells oil pressure gauges, with special pricing for members....might be worth fitting one, to verify that the pressure is where it should be & you don't have a clogged screen situation.:-k

 

[gearhead13]

Yes mine is an EZ model, and the guage just seems to be high. It still run great, and sounds smooth....just the guage needle makes me nervious Thats all.....

Yes, mine makes me nervous as well, thats why I let it cool when it goes over 160C (which is ~320F) Mine must be off more than yours cause it goes much higher than 160 no matter what the ambient temp is

 

[posplayr]

Your bike must be an EZ model, like mine. My oil temp guage just keeps rising up over 160C anything over 20C. When it gets that high I stop and let her cool down. I really dont know how accurate mine is
What do you do with this 'fluke' meter? does it screw into the spot where the old sensor is now or what??
I bought an oil filter cover with the two sensors still on it (off an EZ model) I was thinking of swapping sensors to see if the gauge shows different

It is a general purpose device with sensor at the end of the wire that plugs into the meter. It is a bit of an extravagance, but for something like this it is useful to calibrate your temp sensor. You would probably need to attach it to the side of the sensor (outside). It is probably close to the temp of the oil. You might tape it, tie strap it or mount it mechanically some how.


In Deg F my GS1100 runs about 170-180 on the Cool CA coast (at 65-70 deg F). Climbs to about 240-280 degF out when things are warmer. I have a small oil cooler.

 

[Duro5341]

In the linked post, you mentioned an inaccuracy of 10-15 C in the temp gauge readings. IMO, your bike is not running excessively hot. On my 1100, with prolonged running, with ambient at 25C or higher, I would see 110C, and slightly higher in a traffic jam situation . Adding an oil cooler brought the temps down a bit, and it now displays slightly above 100C, which is the ideal operating temp for these bikes, I believe. I don't think the temps you are seeing, are out of line for a 750, esp. with the gauge off by a bit, on the high side. The flip side of running a cooler up here, is that the bike tends to run cool in the fall/winter, making it hard to reach ideal oil temps.to boil off condensation.
Since the shop has verified the A/F ratio, and you aren't seeing significant blueing/burning at the header, I wouldn't worry about it. Run a quart of synthetic mixed in with the dyno oil ( I used to add Amsoil 0W-40), or even all synthetic, if it will ease your mind.
May I ask which shop did the dyno tuning for you & the charge? I have a set of RS flat slide carbs to throw on and might consider having it dyno-tuned, if the price isn't prohibitive.

Tony.

EDIT: Reno Bruce sells oil pressure gauges, with special pricing for members....might be worth fitting one, to verify that the pressure is where it should be & you don't have a clogged screen situation.:-k

I have cleaned the screen, that was the first thing I did. I just don't like seeing the temp rising to 150 when on the highway, this is on a 70km trip. Just worried about driving 200 km to the cottage, if it would make it. This is with the outside temp being 25 degrees C. When I drive home at midnight (from work) the temp just reach 110 degrees. I guess maybe I am over thinking this problem, I am an auto mechanic and have seen horror stories, and don't want to blow the motor.

I can't add an oil cooler to this bike easily as it is a 750 16v with plain bearings, and no easy ports to tap into like on the 1000's, Or I would have been all over the cooler already. The bike has run 10w40 amsoil since I have owned it, so I know the oil isn't going to break down.

I guess I being over critical about it. I have never owned an air cooled engine before and this is all new to me

The shop was Cycle Improvments on Northfield in Waterloo, they were very good, and professional. I think it was $95.00/hour for dyno tuning. I even gained 5hp when they leaned it out, they also replaced the fork seals

Thanks
Duro

 

[Guest]

Yes, mine makes me nervous as well, thats why I let it cool when it goes over 160C (which is ~320F) Mine must be off more than yours cause it goes much higher than 160 no matter what the ambient temp is

Did the bike do this before the Wiseco kit & other mods? Elevated temps are to be expected with bigger bore/hotter cams etc. My friend had an '83 1100E with the Wiseco big bore kit, Web cams, 36mm carbs, and nitrous etc., and it exhibited the same tendency as you mentioned.....if he didn't stop, it would likely climb all the way to 200C. When we rode together, his bike's gauge would start climbing within a couple km, whereas my stock'ish 1100 would go 20 km or more before the gauge would even begin moving. His bike was a rocket & very entertaining, but not suited for cruising or any distance riding... he has since moved on to a 'Busa.

Tony.

 

[TheCafeKid]

I wouldnt necessarily be concerned bout the temp so much if it didnt happen to be THAT model of GS. I would be more concerned as to whether or not it is FLOWING properly, bleeding the heat, or if you have some clogged passages. Those motors have pretty small flow holes for the head, and crank area. Small enough to easily get clogged. Clogged means obviously the oil isnt flowing as it should, and not drawing the heat off the motor. Those 750s, if theyre not flowing right, or have dirty oil, or low oil, will go BOOM it seems faster than most of the rest of the GS line.. .

 

[gearhead13]

My engine was totally cleaned out when rebuilt, and I only go 2000kms or so between oil changes. I was thinking of using some kind of synthetic, but seems a crapshoot whether it will mess with my clutch, as far as I have read.
The bike doesnt seem to run any (or much I dont think) hotter now than before the mods.
Suzuki really screwed us as far as oil coolers go or I would have one on it now.

 

[Duro5341]

I wouldnt necessarily be concerned bout the temp so much if it didnt happen to be THAT model of GS. I would be more concerned as to whether or not it is FLOWING properly, bleeding the heat, or if you have some clogged passages. Those motors have pretty small flow holes for the head, and crank area. Small enough to easily get clogged. Clogged means obviously the oil isnt flowing as it should, and not drawing the heat off the motor. Those 750s, if theyre not flowing right, or have dirty oil, or low oil, will go BOOM it seems faster than most of the rest of the GS line.. .

Is there anykind of flush that you can put though, that isn't going to ruin the clutch material? If indeed it is a clogged passage. Where can I check the oil pressure? It currently has 39,000kms on the clock

Thanks
Cameron

 

[gearhead13]

People will run seafoam through the crankcase. It would help clean the inside. Personally, I am kinda iffy on that, I think it would dislodge crap and let it run around in your oiling system. I did run some through mine before I rebuilt it and it was ok, just make sure you do a oil/filter change after running it for a while.

 

[Duro5341]

I don't know if I really feel comfortable running a flush through, I have had seen horror stories in the auto industry with gaskets and stuff......

When I dropped the pan to clean the screen, there was no gunk in the corners or nothing, just a light brown film on the pan......nothing I would be worried about if this was a car engine I was working on....but this may be different on a MC

Most of the gunk would settle on the bottom pan would it not?

Duro

 

[Duro5341]

bump^^^^^

I like hearing others opinions.......

Duro

 

[Dave8338]

If you're running straight synthetic in it and change oil as often as you say, you have nothing to worry about. Synthetic oils are GREAT cleaners.

Sounds like you done the work now quit giving yourself gray hair. Get on that bike and ride it...

YOU WILL see bluing of the pipes if it is getting too hot and if it was dyno tuned as you mentioned and the ratio is as you've stated, it is as good as it's going to get. RIDE IT! :-$

 

[Guest]

Yup, I wouldn't sweat it....at most, hook up a RenoBruce pressure gauge (I get no kick-backs!) to make sure everything's kosher. We stop at least twice en route to cottage country for a Timmie's.....(you probably do too?) and the bike doesn't take more than 15-20 mins to cool somewhat.

Tony.

 

[gearhead13]

I pulled out the old sensor and replaced it with the one I got off fleabay (after I cleaned it). Yesterday, on a full days ride in the heat with a passenger I hardly saw it over 100C. I have a heat sensor mounted to the oil filter cover and it rarely gets over 100C. Kind of puts my mind at ease.
As long as you do regular oil changes it will be fine.