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Traffic signal tripper

  • Thread starter Thread starter Anonymous
  • Start date Start date
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Anonymous

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I'm sure many--if not all--of you have had to deal with traffic signals that won't recognise a motorcycle. I don't especially like running red lights or red left turn arrows, so I'd like to find a good, practical solution to this problem. :(

I've heard of hanging a length of pipe under the engine and attaching magnets from PC hard drives underneath the bike. I've also seen the ads for these signal tripping devices, but I don't know anyone who has tried any of them. I do know that putting your side or center stand down on the epoxy seams for some of these signals works. Unfortunately, I don't see many of those where I live.

Have any of you solved this problem? :?
 
I doubt it will work. The sensors embedded in the road generate an inductive field. Metal of sufficient mass causes the field to change and eventually collapse. There is a control device that is set to trip at a certain level. The problem is that the controller is set at too high a threshold to recognize your bike. The highway department can adjust the controller if you call them. Remember though, I said can not will. :wink:

Steel has a much greater effect on inductive fields than aluminum. Combine the fact that your bike has less than 1/5 the mass of the average car with the fact that much of your engine and both wheels are alloy and you can see why we have problems with these things.

I have never tried the sidestand thing, but I suppose it is possible since you are reducing the distance between the target and the inductive coil. I am a little surprised that the small mass of the sidestand would trip it but I'll try it on your say-so.

In any case, you should probably save your money.
 
I popped a strong speaker magnet off an old '50s console on to the center stand of my bike, and this problem went nearly away. There are 1 or 2 lights that resist now, but no where near as many as there used to be.

Magnets interfere with that field more than normal steel, making your bike look like abigger hunk of iron than it is.
 
Here are a couple of sites with some suggestions:

http://motorcycles.about.com/cs/beginners/ht/tripatraflight.htm

http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=92

The two that seem to be the most helpful are:

- Position the bike right over the groove in the pavement where the wire is buried - especially over a corner. Don't sit in the middle of the loop.

- Nag (or threaten to sue :twisted: ) your city, county or state officials until they adjust the sensitivity of the sensor.

Here's an interesting approach in Tennessee - allow mororcyclists to run red lights 8O (Minnesota is considering a similar law):

http://www.tennessean.com/local/archives/03/06/33875988.shtml
 
It looks like Tennessee is trying to take a step in the right direction, but I think there are still some holes. Like this:

He noted that current state road rules say motorists should treat an intersection with a malfunctioning light as a four-way stop.

''We're defining red lights that don't detect motorcycles as inoperable and treating it as a four-way stop,'' Lundwall said.
Click to expand...

By this reasoning, all traffic approching an intersection should stop if there's a motorcycle that isn't being detected by the light controls. Heck, people don't even stop for -functional- lights 100% of the time.

For lightly traveled intersections (like a couple I pass every day on the way to the office) this solution works, but a rider would be nuts to try it in the city during rush-hour traffic.

Dave
 
sounds like Tennessee and Minnesota are trying to reduce their motorcycle population. must have something to do with the double "nn"s
 
sounds like Tennessee and Minnesota are trying to reduce their motorcycle population. must have something to do with the double "nn"s
 
Double post. Heh.

Anyway, if there's a lot of traffic, a car will usually show up behind you and trip the sensor for you.

If there's not a lot of traffic, you should be physically safe in using your eyes and your brain to determine if and when to proceed against a malfunctioning red light.

And yes, I do consider it a malfunction. There's absolutely no reason, other than bureacratic, low-bidder laziness, that the sensors can't be adjusted to respond to motorcycles. And even though the engine cases are aluminum, the crankshaft and rotor are rather large masses of steel whirling away not too far above the pavement.

Whether you're legally safe... it's a gray area in most states. I've stopped, waited, and then proceeded safely through a malfunctioning red light many times at lonely intersections. But I haven't done it with a cop watching. And I'd much rather not be the first one to try this defense in an Indiana traffic court. And I'm sure a lot would depend on the officer if you got stopped and cited for this.

Anyone heard of legal precedents in their state? I've heard of a lawyer who's just itching to get cited for running a malfunctioning red light -- he carries a copy of the relevant law in his wallet just in case. I'm not a lwayer, nor am I rich or bored enough to fight city hall on this minor issue.
 
Magnets interfere with that field more than normal steel, making your bike look like abigger hunk of iron than it is.
Click to expand...

Actually, that is not really accurate. A permanent magnet will only trip an inductive sensor if the magnet and sensor are very similar in frequency. The likelyhood that a random magnet would be close enough to the roadway sensor is slim at best. Polarity and mounting distance will influence magent strength, complicating things further.

Also, various companies make these sensing systems. It is doubtful that these different systems would work at the same frequency. Therefore, even if a particular magnet worked on lights in a specific town, it may not the next town over.

If it has worked for you, the most probable reason is that your magnet is very dense and has a high ferrous metal content. I'm not saying it absolutely can't work, but I would advise against paying money for a "magic box" without some real third-party testing.

If udco wants to fool around with some supplies he already has on hand I guess he has nothing to lose.
 
i have seen newly installed lights not trip. I just take a left turn and then into a nother parking lot till i get around the light.
 
I've just learned, it Tennessee it is not legal to go thru a parking lot to bypass a traffic light.
 
G man said:
Magnets interfere with that field more than normal steel, making your bike look like abigger hunk of iron than it is.
Click to expand...

Actually, that is not really accurate. A permanent magnet will only trip an inductive sensor if the magnet and sensor are very similar in frequency. The likelyhood that a random magnet would be close enough to the roadway sensor is slim at best. Polarity and mounting distance will influence magent strength, complicating things further.

Also, various companies make these sensing systems. It is doubtful that these different systems would work at the same frequency. Therefore, even if a particular magnet worked on lights in a specific town, it may not the next town over.
Click to expand...

How about using the whole speaker instead of just the magnet? Hook it up to a CD player playing rap to get a large, fairly random "disturbance in the force" that might activate these stupid sensors. A moving magnet (like a speaker playing) should really trip the trigger.

I'm only about 3/4 kidding. Can you imagine "boom bikes" competing with the "boom cars" at stoplights? Finally, we'd have something more than just exhaust...
 
Permanent magnets don't have a frequency; their field is static.
 
Cow Magnets.

cowmag1.gif
 
bwringer said:
How about using the whole speaker instead of just the magnet? Hook it up to a CD player playing rap to get a large, fairly random "disturbance in the force" that might activate these stupid sensors. A moving magnet (like a speaker playing) should really trip the trigger.

I'm only about 3/4 kidding. Can you imagine "boom bikes" competing with the "boom cars" at stoplights? Finally, we'd have something more than just exhaust...
Click to expand...

I actually looked into this. (not so much a boom bike, but at least reasonable music that would be loud enough to be audible over engine/wind/road noise)

Not with a GS unfortunately.:(

All the big (or even medium) amplifiers will take more (usually MUCH MUCH more) than the 15amps that our main fuse is.

I looked into just installing some 5 1/4 speakers and a small amp to run them.
Anything over about 20 watts/channel (real power, not the inflated numbers some manufacturers quote) just aint happening.

The boom boom cars are in the hundreds to even thousands of watts range.

The louder ones kill normal car alternators (150 amps or so) and need special high output alternators and dual batteries and such nonsense.

To get back on topic, I have some blown speakers and light that has a bad sensor near me ... time for some experiments.
 
Anonymous said:
I'm sure many--if not all--of you have had to deal with traffic signals that won't recognise a motorcycle. I don't especially like running red lights or red left turn arrows, so I'd like to find a good, practical solution to this problem. :(
Click to expand...
The most practical solution is to find out from your police department or highway departmen who is responsible for the sensors and ask them to make the adjustments. We are fortunate in our corner of southwest oHIo in that one of the supervisors in charge of adjusting the traffic light sensors is also a motorcyclist. :dancing: He has been known to bring his own bike out to make sure the sensor trips. :clap:

.
 
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