Two questions:Chain is loose AND tight, front wheel is crooked

[MrZig]

I'm working on a '78 GS400 and I have two questions:

When I straighten my handlebars with the body and look at the bike from the front, the wheel is crooked to it's left. Enough to be noticable; how do I fix this?

Secondly, I adjusted my chain's slackness today and made it about an inch of travel. I spun the wheel around and the chain tightened up and stopped the wheel. I turned it some more and the chain got super loose, enough to create two inches of travel. I spun it some more and it repeated the process.

Do I need a new chain and sprockets?

 

[Guest]

That chain is toast, once it develops tight spots like you described. Most recommend changing with new sprockets, and quite likely your sprockets are worn too, if used with the chain in that condition for a while.
The wheel alignment problem sounds worrisome ...someone should be able to help with that.

Tony.

 

[bwringer]

Yes, you need a new chain and sprockets. It's quite normal that a chain wears out unevenly like that.

As far as the front end, has the bike been down or run into anything? Assuming the handlebars aren't bent, sometimes the forks twist in the triple clamps when there's an "incident". You can loosen the pinch bolts and, if you're lucky, you might be able to bump the fork back into alignment. Of course, this is no good if the fork tubes are bent, but it don't cost nuthin' and works surprisingly often.

 

[MrZig]

That chain is toast, once it develops tight spots like you described. Most recommend changing with new sprockets, and quite likely your sprockets are worn too, if used with the chain in that condition for a while.
The wheel alignment problem sounds worrisome ...someone should be able to help with that.

Tony.

How do I find out what chain & sprockets my bike uses? Should a dealership know? And how much $ should it run me?

Edit:

As far as the front end, has the bike been down or run into anything? Assuming the handlebars aren't bent, sometimes the forks twist in the triple clamps when there's an "incident". You can loosen the pinch bolts and, if you're lucky, you might be able to bump the fork back into alignment. Of course, this is no good if the fork tubes are bent, but it don't cost nuthin' and works surprisingly often.

The bike may have been down before, it wouldn't surprise me. Are you saying to undo the clamps on each front shock absorber, like? I'm going to take it to a mechanic and see what he says about it as well.

 

[Guest]

How do I find out what chain & sprockets my bike uses? Should a dealership know? And how much $ should it run me?

Z1 enterprises should be able to hook you up with chain & sprockets. Jeff, the owner, is a fellow GSR member.... the prices and service are recommended by many here.
http://www.z1enterprises.com/

Tony.

 

[bwringer]

Your best bet for a new chain and sprockets is definitely NOT a Suzuki dealer. The OEM stuff is extremely expensive.

I'd call Z1 Enterprises ( http://z1enterprises.com ) or Cycle Recycle II ( http://crc2onlinecatalog.com ).

Your bike uses a 530 chain, same size as a Hayabusa, so you don't need a $250 top-of-the-line chain. Just ask for a reasonably priced o-ring chain -- don't fart around with an unsealed chain unless you're selling the bike tomorrow. Sprocket brands are also unimportant. Just get whatever's reasonably priced. You'll also want to stick to stock sprocket sizes.

There are three different elements to juggle, plus figure out what's in stock, etc. so it's usually easiest to just call.

You should be able to get away for around $100 to $120 total.

 

[bwringer]

I'm going to take it to a mechanic and see what he says about it as well.

That way lies only madness, pain, expense and sorrow, as some here have found. There are very, very few mechanics that are capable and trustworthy with vintage bikes.

Look in the mirror, and you'll see the very best possible mechanic for your vintage bike. Caring about what you're doing, taking your time, and paying attention are far more important.

Use the site search, ask questions, and tell us where you are -- perhaps there's a GSR member nearby.

 

[bwringer]

The bike may have been down before, it wouldn't surprise me. Are you saying to undo the clamps on each front shock absorber, like?

Loosen the pinch bolts a bit -- less than a turn each, probably only half a turn. You want to remove some tension so that they can turn a little in the clamps, but you don't want to remove too much tension or else the tripled clamps might slide down the forks.

 

[MrZig]

That way lies only madness, pain, expense and sorrow, as some here have found. There are very, very few mechanics that are capable and trustworthy with vintage bikes.

Look in the mirror, and you'll see the very best possible mechanic for your vintage bike. Caring about what you're doing, taking your time, and paying attention are far more important.

Use the site search, ask questions, and tell us where you are -- perhaps there's a GSR member nearby.

This is true, however I have found someone about a half an hour away who specialises in older japanese bikes. He told me he's worked on a few GS400's before, too, so that's a bonus.

Edit: By the way I'm in Enderby, BC, Canada. Hour away from Kelowna.

 

[MrZig]

Your best bet for a new chain and sprockets is definitely NOT a Suzuki dealer. The OEM stuff is extremely expensive.

I'd call Z1 Enterprises ( http://z1enterprises.com ) or Cycle Recycle II ( http://crc2onlinecatalog.com ).

Your bike uses a 530 chain, same size as a Hayabusa, so you don't need a $250 top-of-the-line chain. Just ask for a reasonably priced o-ring chain -- don't fart around with an unsealed chain unless you're selling the bike tomorrow. Sprocket brands are also unimportant. Just get whatever's reasonably priced. You'll also want to stick to stock sprocket sizes.

There are three different elements to juggle, plus figure out what's in stock, etc. so it's usually easiest to just call.

You should be able to get away for around $100 to $120 total.

How do I find out how many links the OEM chain uses, and which size sprockets?

Edit: Looks like it uses a 104 chain, but not sure about the sprockets.

 

[Suzuki mad]

This is true, however I have found someone about a half an hour away who specialises in older japanese bikes. He told me he's worked on a few GS400's before, too, so that's a bonus.

Edit: By the way I'm in Enderby, BC, Canada. Hour away from Kelowna.

Mr Zig, I would say that you have just given away a large amount of your hard earned money and 50% of the fun of owning and riding a classic motorcycle.

Lets hope he does know what he's talking about and doesn't rip you off.

 

[gearman]

Edit: Looks like it uses a 104 chain, but not sure about the sprockets.

It looks like the '78 GS400 uses a #530 chain/104 links and 16T/45T sprockets. It wouldn't surprise me if a shop charged $75+ for labor to install a chain/sprocket.

 

[Sandy]

A good resource for info on your bike is Alpha-Sports. They have on-line micro fiche for your bike which is handy to find out parts and how things go together. Use the link below -> select your year -> select your model -> then choose what you're looking for. In your case choose "rear wheel" for the rear sprocket and "transmission" for the front sprocket and chain. Your sizes are 16T for the front sprocket, 45T for the rear and 104L for the chain.

http://www.alpha-sports.com/suzuki_parts.htm

 

[MrZig]

Mr Zig, I would say that you have just given away a large amount of your hard earned money and 50% of the fun of owning and riding a classic motorcycle.

Lets hope he does know what he's talking about and doesn't rip you off.

Oh, no, I won't be using a mechanic for everything. In fact I'm pretty mechanically inclined as I've changed a transmission, transfercase, etc etc on my own Jeep Cherokee. It's just little things on a bike that I have no clue about, and I learn mechanical things a lot better in person than by reading. I'm hoping he's friendly enough to show me around the bike so that I may do all this stuff on my own. And I know what a ripoff is when I see it so if he tries anything fishy I'll walk away.

Like I said, the only reason I'll get him to help out is when I'm stuck. I don't want to do anything wrong on a bike that'll be seeing 120kph!

 

[bwringer]

There's a link on Z1's site to his sprocket supplier (JT, I think). There, you'll find more detailed info about the sprockets that fit your bike.

Since you've already got good mechanical savvy, you'll figure out the bike stuff pretty quickly!

 

[Tazman001]

chain loose and tight

chain loose and tight

I hope no one takes it wrong, I'm not trying to be a know it all, but every chain has a "high" spot and a "low" spot. Even a brand new set of sprockets and chain. When adjusting a chain, it must be adjusted on the "high" spot. Easy to find, just spin the rear wheel, and find the most tight spot, that's it.

 

[MrZig]

I hope no one takes it wrong, I'm not trying to be a know it all, but every chain has a "high" spot and a "low" spot. Even a brand new set of sprockets and chain. When adjusting a chain, it must be adjusted on the "high" spot. Easy to find, just spin the rear wheel, and find the most tight spot, that's it.

I've heard of this, but I think mine is excessive. The loose spot has so much slack, when I push up on the bottom chain, the top part moves almost in unison.

Also at low speeds you can really feel it loosening and tightening, and it makes low speed manouvers difficult.

 

[Smokinapankake]

Consider the possibility too that the rear sprocket may not be exactly centered. This will give what appears to be a tight spot on the chain. Probably not enough to worry about, though.

 

[GS750GUY]

I also do not want to come across as an expert by any means regarding this subject but would like to interject what I had learned regarding chains and spockets.
At about 12,000 miles I experienced the exact same situation with my 78 GS750EC.
The bike was horribly neglected by its previous owner and the chain probably never taken care of.
I did a lot of study on chains and spockets and found that the sprockets themselves were showing absoulutely none of the wear signs that articles said to look for. However the chain was very rusty with several stiff and kinky links and with more than one tight spot.
One article I read said that some people recommend that you should always replace the sprockets any time you replace the chain and the writer of this article said this is typically the people that sell sprockets and chains that are telling you this and he went on to say that this was not necessary and could be a total waste of money. He recommended that you only need to replace sprockets when they show the typical signs of being worn out. If under norman riding conditions the sprockets are showing none of the signs of being worn out you should be able to use two chains (and he said sometimes maybe more than 2) for every one set of sprockets.
Since the sprockets on my GS looked great I just replaced the chain with a high quality "O" ring sealed chain and noticed an immediate improvement in performance.
Now, am I shortening the life of my new chain by not intalling new sprockets as well?? Could be..... but who knows for sure......and is the additional cost of new sprockets each time you replace a chain really worth the exta money spent?
Just some thoughts.
GS750GUY

 

[MrZig]

Just as small victory update, I loosened up both clamps on the forks and bumped the wheel against a wall - it's now straightened out as far as I can eyeball it! Thanks for the tips.