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Velocity porting vs. Oldschool porting

  • Thread starter Thread starter speedy400
  • Start date Start date
Using epoxy on the intake ports is not really new. I was doing this back in the 80's on my GS1000...It works the best if you use the later model "big port" head. I raised the angle of the intake port so much that I cut into the lifter cavity. Then I made some custom aluminum spacers and J-B welded them into the lifter cavity just below the spring base. This method along with using epoxy on the floor allowed me to obtain a more direct shot down the back of the intake valve head. The whole idea is to turn the air/fuel as soon as possible before it reaches the back of the intake valve as it will then flow in a cone around the valve into the chamber. By raising the floor you can turn it earlier. You also must know that when the air/fuel makes the sharp turn around the short side radius that it flows better with a flat surface. So looking into the intake port from the carb side the port should go from round to flat (in the curve) and back to round. The added benefit is that by doing this you make the short side and the long side more equal in lenght which is very desirable......On the exhaust side you want to raise the roof of the port as far as you can without creating a "lip" when you put your gasket in place. Almost all of the exhaust flows at the top of the port. Same thing applys, make the floor on the short side turn as flat as possible, only removing material from the sides to get the shape. After using something similar to epoxy in the exhaust ports to get that D shape on the floor, I can clearly see where all the flow is as the high flow areas burn away the material I used. Same as the intake, shape goes round then flat and then round.....keeping velocities high. If you want to get good at porting heads or just want to do a real good job on your own head, gather every book and magazine article you can find about cylinder porting and read them. A. Graham Bell wrote a very good book on 4 stroke performance tuning many years ago that is a must have. Smokey Yunick also wrote some very good stuff.....I have in my old racing folder, secret (well not now) tips and diagrams on how to port a nascar head. Its a compilation of all the bits and pieces that you learn that make a great cylinder head.......My race heads just laying around in the garage, maybe I can take a pic or two to share..........BadbillyB
 
Heres a couple of pics of my ports. Intake
PortPics001.jpg

Exhaust
PortPics003.jpg
 
Notice in the pic of the exhaust port, you can see the material added to the floor. Flat around the corner, then right before the gasket, the fire has eaten away the added material right in the center of the floor. These ports have been filled with Manley A&B compound, not epoxy. It is a 2 part material and hardens within about 10 minutes. I made a ball of it before using it and after a 30 minuteb cure, I dropped it on the floor and it sounded and bounced like a big fat marble. Very hard stuff, but wont last long in an exhaust port.....Great for drag racing though......BadBillyB
 
That guy's website is weak. Theres a lot more to porting an intake than laying a wad of JB weld in there. IMO JB weld is way too runny and requires up to 12 hours of babysitting to keep it where you want it. I dont even like JB weld as it has always fallen below my expectations whenever I have used it for anything. If you are expecting good results from a port job, you must know way more than this guy tells you about making an intake port flow well. It starts at the carb boot and ends in the combustion chamber. Every part of the port is a player. The floor, the roof, the sides, the angle, the bowl, the valve seat etc....Manley A&B Epoxy is my choice. It cures fast, 1 hour, requires no babysitting and is easily shaped with your finger, with no drooling.....If you want to do a nice port job yourself, become a sponge, and read everything about porting that you can get your hands on. Been there, done that, and have the trophys, plaques and national record certificates to back it up. Now if I could only get my 28 year old carbs sorted out, I'll be on a roll.......BadBillyB
 
Stick to your guns BillyB. You seem to know what you're talking about. Where can I get this Manley A&B you talk about. I'm in Canada.
Would it last very long in a street motor?
Oh yeh, & more pictures would help too

Paul
 
I use A&B apoxy by Moroso. Using it for years. Have it in the heads of my race car. Good stuff. I let it set up over night. I use a cup of water when working it into the final shape. A wet finger tip keeps it from sticking. I use regular modeling clay to make changes to the ports while on the flow bench. When I find something the port likes I make it happen with the epoxy. Alot to be said for keeping the velocity as hi as you can. I think that is the point he was trying to make. Most head shops make them too large. I know that what we try to achieve in my shop is the most flow with the smallest port. Might want to give it a try if you havn't...might be surprised. Been doing heads for over 25 years, everything from Pro-Stock to Nascar. My heads have been around Daytona a few times too. As they say..'just the facts mam'.
 
Rebuttal

Rebuttal

BADBILLYB: You should listen to HEADSBIKESMOPARS, he really knows what he's talking about when it comes to head modification to squeeze out all the power in them. He's been doing this type of massaging for 25 yrs + If you knew his name you would know him immediately. He wants to remain anomous. His heads were on the winning car at the first race at california race track last year one of the military cars can't tell you the # you'd know rite off. Some of his customers have won championships in the pro stock circuit and the top fuel series as well. He still holds 2 (two) national records with his 72 Duster.
 
Nines, I appreciate the kind remarks. True..I have some credits I am proud of. I am modest by nature and try not to take credit for the success that others have achieved thru thier hard work and dedication. True I have built some of the heads that have been on successful teams (NHRA and NASCAR and some of the independent racers as well). But as many well know..heads are an important factor in any engine combo, but not the ONLY thing. Many more factors involved. Thanks for the anonymity, I am just one of the guys. And my passion is motorcycles. And mostly Suzuki's. I am a new member to this board although I have visited it many times over the years. There are many good and knowledgeable people on this board and BadBillyB, is one of them. We are all in good company. Lead on guys.
 
Not trying to start **** here, but all this anonimity and skirt blowing looks like a bunch of aliases talking someone up. You tell me who you are and I'll tell you who I am?
 
fat_sac said:
Not trying to start **** here, but all this anonimity and skirt blowing looks like a bunch of aliases talking someone up. You tell me who you are and I'll tell you who I am?
Click to expand...

I am Dink, been here seven years. If you dont know me by now you aint trying.
Dink
 
fat_sac said:
Not trying to start **** here, but all this anonimity and skirt blowing looks like a bunch of aliases talking someone up. You tell me who you are and I'll tell you who I am?
Click to expand...
Both these guys seem to know what they are talking about. I can't say I blame them for not posting under their real names.
Dink said:
I am Dink, been here seven years. If you dont know me by now you aint trying.
Dink
Click to expand...
I can assure everyone my name really is Billy Ricks.
 
I am Billy Birch. I am a 51 year old retired semi-pro m/c dragracer. The track announcer at my local track dubbed me "Bad Billy Birch".....I got nothing to hide. I have always done my own cylinder head porting and had good results. I did my homework by reading every article, magazine and book I could get my hands on that had articles on porting techniques. I also used to lurk around the professional racers pit area in hopes of getting a peek into their ports (and I did) Maybe I should have been "SneakyBillyB". I also had friends who purchased big buck pro stock heads from VHR and as soon as they arrived, we examined every detail of the ports....It's the total of all these things learned that make you a good head porter....I saw the mototune pages long ago and left there without learning anything. It only illustrates how to modify the port floor and this mod is "Oldschool" ....Pro Stock bikes were running epoxy in the ports back in the mid 80's....I also made a post a while back about a book I recommended to you all http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?t=79245&highlight=bellthat shows how to modify the floor of your m/c intake port w/epoxy. Think it was written in the early 80's.....I was just pointing out that the scope of the mototune site is very narrow. If I thought the mototune guy was a member on this board, I never would have stated my opinion. So, anyway, I'm just an old m/c dragracer that likes to share all I learned over the years racing a old GeeWizzer 1000 .........BadBillyB
 
Smokey used to say "A 747 would have flown 2000 years ago". Smokey had a way with the truth. He often amazed me. I learned very much just watching him. Quite the innovator he was. What he meant by that was just because something is 'old'..dosen't mean it is bad, (time limitation). Works for me. Sorry for the **** , just offering my input..is all. My last post. Heads Bikes and Mopars.
 
I hope nobody got their skirt ruffled here, because I for one wished we had more people like BadBillyB and Headsbikesmopars around here. The way I see it is that hundreds of people raced the big GS's back in the day, but you don't see much detailed technical info here about what they did to win. I want to know what made a winning head, crank, tranny, or whatever.

A good engine design is like a good pizza. There's 100 different ways to do it and most of them produce great results.

I myself am not interested in building a dragbike. I want a hotrod 750 streetbike, however there is much to be learned in the porting of a dragbike head all the same.

Stick around guys, and share your knowledge. There are many here that appreciate it to no end.....
 
Yeah, I didn't mean to upset anyone. I was just kidding. I''ve never even done any head work. I just watch my father do it. I guess that's the ****ty thing about the internet, you can't read ppl's tone through text. I just wanted to know who you guys were.
 
Guys like headsbikesmopars, with the wealth of knowledge and info they share is what makes this site so great.....it matters little what their names are, where they are located etc.....I hope you choose to stay and contribute to the GSR, headsbikes !

Tony.
 
I personally would like Headsbikesandmopars to stick around this site as he seems to know quite a bit. I dont care if he wants to keep his identity private. He has given positive input to this topic and I hope I didn't offend him. Modifying 2V Suzuki motors is my passion but I have gotten too old to race and my hands are too eaten up with arthritis to port cylinder heads. My eyes do not see the things they once could....But, it is still my passion and I would like to share the experience and knowledge that I learned from racing a 2V Suzuki for 10 years.......Before this, it was a highly modified street bike, so I can offer some advise on what worked for me back when it was a street terror..........To get back on topic, I will try and get some new pics of my ports with the valves removed so you can get a better idea of what worked for me.........BadBillyB
 
fat_sac said:
Not trying to start **** here, but all this anonimity and skirt blowing looks like a bunch of aliases talking someone up. You tell me who you are and I'll tell you who I am?
Click to expand...

So who are you??

Dink
 
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