Welding the Crank on my 1980 1100E

[Boozy Creek Beast]

I was talking with a friend with loads of bike knowledge. We were talking about preformance and the differances between the 1980 1100 and the newer bikes. He told me that one of the only week points on my 1980 is the crank and that in order to make it stronger for the days that I do some hard rideing I should weld the crank. He mentioned that the 82 and newer bikes have a welded or solid crank and they never have a problem. I am not planning to drag race my beast but I am in the process of installing a 1166 kit and was wondering that since I have the engine apart would it be a good thing to have the crank welded? Is it a difficult thing to have done and what could I expect this to set me back. I was also wondering if my friend is just blowing smoke up my A#@!

The Beast :twisted:

 

[Hoomgar]

Greg, for sure. Get it welded while you have the cases split buddy. It is expensive however so shop around but beware that not everyone does the same quality work.

I had mine done at Falicon Performance (727-797-2468) in Florida 2 years ago and it set me back over 600. I forget the exact price but was told by many that for what I had done (trued (because it was already twisted) welded and a new output end piece then balanced) that I got a good deal.

For sure get it done.

 

[Boozy Creek Beast]

I did not expect it to be that expensive. I have never split the case before. Do I need any special tools. Is there a lot of work envolved and should I be able to do it by myself.

The Beast :twisted:

 

[RacingJake]

If you want it welded check with Jay over at APE GSZone. They have the best price for welding, 80 bucks. I was going to send them my 1000 run crank but it spit out a bigend bearing before I could mail it

 

[marcovandevelde]

Yeah, get that crank welded! A simple backfire or harsh downshift can already twist your crank. This will not only create lots of vibration but will also ruin your crank-bearings. As the crank is a one-piece-built-up affair this will set you back far more if it needs replacing than the welding.

Get a workshop manual first!
Just get the engine out, take the head & cylinders off. Remove the pistons. Remove the clutch and the bolts/plates behind it, remove all upper casing bolts, turn it upside down and remove all the remaining lower casing bolts. You can now split the cases (be sure to get EVERY bolt off!), you shouldn't need much force. If it does, check again for forgotten bolts before you crack the casings. If the cases are split, you can lift the crank out.

Oh yes, be sure to loosen the clutch-basket nut by locking the back brake in 3rd gear, or you won't be able to loosen it without blocking gears etc.

Good luck!

 

[Boozy Creek Beast]

Thanks for all of the great information. 80 dollars sounds a lot better than 600. As for cracking the case open I have a Clymer manual that has been good for all of the work that I have done so far but I am not sure it covers cracking open the case. If not is there someone that might know where I can get a Shop Manual?

The Beast :twisted:

 

[Hoomgar]

Thanks for all of the great information. 80 dollars sounds a lot better than 600. As for cracking the case open I have a Clymer manual that has been good for all of the work that I have done so far but I am not sure it covers cracking open the case. If not is there someone that might know where I can get a Shop Manual?

The Beast :twisted:

It sure does Greg. Like I said, I had a lot of other things done including new pieces so my cost was higher. Most tell me that the work I had done will run over 800 so I got lucky. I believe you will find that for 80 all your getting is a weld. Better make sure the crank is true before you send it in if that is the case. Maybe they will check it for you? These drag bike guys know who to take stuff to so I am sure the shop does good work.

Also I saw this place mentioned in another thread. You may want to also check these guys out mentioned in Jon's post here:
Although shipping may become an issue if they are in the UK :wink:
http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/viewtopic.php?p=427790&highlight=#427790


You can do it!

 

[Boozy Creek Beast]

At this time I am belive my crank is good. I am not get vibarations or at least none that I can feel at this time. Could it be noticeable if it was a small bend. or dose it have to be larger to notice. Do to my limited resources and knowledge I may just put that issue on hold until I am better suited for the procedure.

The Beast :twisted:

 

[Hoomgar]

At this time I am belive my crank is good. I am not get vibarations or at least none that I can feel at this time. Could it be noticeable if it was a small bend. or dose it have to be larger to notice. Do to my limited resources and knowledge I may just put that issue on hold until I am better suited for the procedure.

The Beast :twisted:

You can tell with a simple check. I think I know the procedure but I will let one of the drag bike guys explain. It involves taking measurements down the plug holes to the top of the pistons. Two should always be the same I believe but I know there is more.

Can anyone help here? Jake?

 

[Boozy Creek Beast]

If I find that it is bent can it be straightened. If it is not bent and I do not want to crack the case are bent cranks normally a common problem. I mean how necessary is it to have the crank welded if all I plan to do is normal rideing with a couple of wheelies thrown in everyonce in a while to jump start my heart. :lol:

The Beast :twisted:

 

[RacingJake]

Here's a simple check that I do after a hard night of racing. It won't tell you if your're .001 out, but will tell you if your're 1/4 of an inch out and further inspection is required.

I remove all the sparkplugs and turn the crank over until it's at TDC for #1&4 piston. Then I run a plastic straw straight down the #1 cylinder until it hits the top of the piston and mark the straw at the top of the sparkplug hole. Then take the straw and run it down the #4 cylinder sparkplug hole and see if the marks line up. Make sure you keep the straw or whatever you use up against the threads of the holes and go straight down.

I do it all the time and if the readings are not the same then I'll pull the head off and see how the pistons lineup in the bore's at TDC.

From what I hear when a crank twist's, it twist's alot so this gives me alittle piece of mind but then again I'm always tearing my engine apart to do other work on it.

It's not a 100% test due to carbon buildup, warp head, gasket compression, etc. but once you get a reading and the same reading month after month then I feel there's not a problem down there at least not now that's when Murphy's Law takes over.

Right now I got a 83 bigend crank that was factory welded only along the crankshaft centerline. So I guess that's where a crank will twist? I like to hear from the folks that twisted a crank as to where it did twist.... crankshaft centerline or connecting rod line???

Don't know if it's helps but it's my .02 cents

 

[Hoomgar]

I like to hear from the folks that twisted a crank as to where it did twist.... crankshaft centerline or connecting rod line???

Thats what I don't know. Mine was "severely" twisted I was told but I don't know where. I wasn't "in the know" enough to ask at the time :?


Greg, to answer your question, yes these cranks twisting is a common problem. I would get it welded for sure if your going to have it out anyway.

 

[yak]

do the falicon deal it will be balanced and perfectly straight ready for all the wheeleys and burnouts u,r heart can stand 10000 rpm !! or leave it alone ride it with the respect a 25 year old missle deserves smoke a tire every now and then and if u twist a crank u,ll know it it will run ok make desent power but just won,t feel right

 

[Guest]

All of these GS cranks should be welded. Before we weld it, we have an 18mm rod that we put through all four wrist pin holes at the same time. If it won't go through all four, then it is twisted.

The only thing worse that having a twisted crank is sending it to someone who welds it in that position.

Jay

 

[Hoomgar]

All of these GS cranks should be welded. Before we weld it, we have an 18mm rod that we put through all four wrist pin holes at the same time. If it won't go through all four, then it is twisted.

The only thing worse that having a twisted crank is sending it to someone who welds it in that position.

Jay

That is what I was trying to say to you earlier Greg only Jay put it much better. I vote that you should weld it and although you don't want to spend too much money still you need to make sure it is straight for sure before you get it welded. If you weld it with a slight twist for the sake of saving a few dollars in the long run you haven't saved anything. Honestly, the crank could very well be the single most expensive part of a GS engine overhaul but it is also a foundational component that must be right. That was why I went the cost and got it done right. I'll have no regrets when it is done.

 

[Jon]

Cranks !

Cranks !

I had my crank sorted by "Crankshafts Unlimited" of Canvey Island, Essex, Uk. Would recommend their services to anybody looking for quality.
For ?400. pounds sterling they replaced all my bearings, fitted new weight matched rods, lightened the whole thing, welded it, and dynamically balanced it. Good quick turn-around, and very freindly.
Cheers
Jon.

 

[Boozy Creek Beast]

Well I guess with all of the info. given I should take the time and have it done right. I like the the $80.00 price tag rather than the more expensive ones. If BIG JAY could give me some information about A.P.E's services and the cost I would more than likely send it there. I have delt with A.P.E on several occasion and have always gotten good friendly service at a decent price. If any one has someone that they trust and dose not mind giving out the info. my ears are open.

The Beast :twisted:

 

[Boozy Creek Beast]

I just spoke with a guy at A.P.E. and he told me that the cost of getting my Crank Magna fluxed, Straightened, and Welded will cost me aroung 180.00 plus shipping with a 3 week turn around. So for around 200.00 I should be able to take care of my Crank and be able to do wheeles with no fear.

The Beast :twisted:

 

[Hoomgar]

I just spoke with a guy at A.P.E. and he told me that the cost of getting my Crank Magna fluxed, Straightened, and Welded will cost me aroung 180.00 plus shipping with a 3 week turn around. So for around 200.00 I should be able to take care of my Crank and be able to do wheeles with no fear.

The Beast :twisted:

And they have a good name in our community so it sounds like you found a really good deal

You'll be really glad you did this Greg years from now when you are still running hard and no twisted crank. Especially when you see guys post who have twisted theirs.

Jammin!

 

[Guest]

I just spoke with a guy at A.P.E. and he told me that the cost of getting my Crank Magna fluxed, Straightened, and Welded will cost me aroung 180.00 plus shipping with a 3 week turn around. So for around 200.00 I should be able to take care of my Crank and be able to do wheeles with no fear.

The Beast :twisted:

There was apparently a misunderstanding. The price you were quoted is for a plain bearing crank.

For roller cranks we offer check for twist and weld $79.00 If it is twisted, then we will quote a rebuild / repair.

Jay