Which is a better manual Clymer or Haynes

[Jimmin]

I have the Clymer manual for 1981 GS1100EX which is in sad shape. Overall it was a good manual not great. I need to replace it.

Would anyone recommend one over the other.

 

[hampshirehog]

You've got the best one of the 2 - Haynes miss loads of stuff out.

 

[Killer2600]

Agreed clymer is considered the better of the two to most wrenchers

 

[tkent02]

But they both suck compared to the Suzuki book.

 

[tomm]

I have all three, and each has some things that the others don't. I'd rate them as Clymer, Suzuki and Haynes in that order based on which one typically helps me the most to figure out what I'm doing. But more times than not, I end up referencing all three before starting something I haven't previously tried.

 

[Jimmin]

Thx for all your replies

 

[Road_Clam]

I have the Clymer manual for 1981 GS1100EX which is in sad shape. Overall it was a good manual not great. I need to replace it.

Would anyone recommend one over the other.

They both suck.

There is much contraversary over bad, and innacurate GS specs thet stem from the basic and vague information from the generic manualls. Do yourself a huge favor and buy the factory Suzuki manuals. The offer a wealth of good, accurate info..

 

[tomm]

They both suck.

There is much contraversary over bad, and innacurate GS specs thet stem from the basic and vague information from the generic manualls. Do yourself a huge favor and buy the factory Suzuki manuals. The offer a wealth of good, accurate info..

When I bought my '78, I also bought what I thought was the Suzuki service manual. Not much different than the current Clymer manual. Now you're making me question what I actually bought 30 years ago, not that I'm going to do anything about it now. Maybe they got better over time. More likely, I didn't get what I thought I did. :?

 

[tcraft128]

http://www.mtsac.edu/~cliff/storage/gs/GS1100E_Owners_Manual.pdf

This is the 1100E manual off of Bikecliff's site. Maybe?

I have all three manuals for my bike, but I have been using the Haynes to soak up used oil cause it is trash compared to the Clymer. IMO of course.

 

[Jimmin]

Based on most input I went for Clymer.

Thx

 

[bwringer]

I have all three, and each has some things that the others don't. I'd rate them as Clymer, Suzuki and Haynes in that order based on which one typically helps me the most to figure out what I'm doing. But more times than not, I end up referencing all three before starting something I haven't previously tried.

Close -- they ALL suck.

The Suzuki manual loves to tell you useless things like: "Step 1: Remove Engine" or "Use special service tool #768676QWG1-0988YTR9 to remove the frammis valve assembly..."

Get all the sources of information you can. Consult all three. Compare the specs given, and recoil in horror at how many are different. Which one is incorrect? Who knows?

All these manuals love to illustrate critical procedures with one tiny photo taken by candlelight, and then devote lavish eight page spreads to replacing the brake light bulb.

They also all leave out all the vital information and techniques related to working on elderly machinery. Granted, they were written when the bikes were new, but you'll be led far astray by many of the troubleshooting diagrams that assume every electrical connection is perfect and nothing leaks.

Gather all the info you can, and regard it all with deep suspicion. Cross-check and verify.

 

[chuckycheese]

Over and over....

Over and over....

I didn't read all of the responses because we've been 'down this road' so many times. I have both the Clymer and official Suzuki shop manuals for both of my bikes and here's how it is:

(1) Neither is great but both are good. Owning both is very worthwhile because they compliment each other.
(2The Clymer folks made some extraordinary mistakes with regard to administrative things in the GS1100 book (table of contents refers to the wrong pages in almost every section).
(3) There are misleading and incorrect pictures in both manuals; just because it's in the book, don't assume it's the same part that's on your bike.
(4) At times, both manuals assume that you know things you shouldn't be expected to know.
(5) The Clymer manual mistakes are mostly because of stupidity and carelessness, whereas, the mistakes in the Japster manual are because of language translation and their thinking that everyone understands the bikes as well as they do.

I don't know anything about the Haynes' books but I suspect they're the lessor of the three, based upon anecdotal things I've read. I hope someone makes this a 'sticky' because it's a subject that's been discussed too often with the same predictable result.

 

[Road_Clam]

Close -- they ALL suck.

The Suzuki manual loves to tell you useless things like: "Step 1: Remove Engine" or "Use special service tool #768676QWG1-0988YTR9 to remove the frammis valve assembly..."

.

Dude, give me a break, you have to read the factory Suzuki to remember how to remove the frammis valve assembly? cripes, I can't believe i'm reading this BS

Be glad you will probably never have to recalibrate the miskinish modulator.....

 

[tomm]

Instructions below:

The Mishkinish Modulator works with the Frammis Valve to limit saddle time. The two components should be inspected and / or replaced whenever the motorcycle is running perfectly, or every 11.26 miles, whichever occurs first.

WARNING: Do not attempt this procedure unless: 1) It is either a Saturday or a Sunday. 2) The temperature is between 65 and 80 degress F, and 3) the weather is either sunny or mostly sunny.

These parts are located in the transmission between the 3rd and 4th driven gears.
Haynes Manual: Some minor dissassembly required.
Clymer Manual: Follow the directions in the 24 8x10 glossy photographs with the circles and arrows on the front of each one telling what each one is all about.
Suzuki Manual: Unless you are experienced, refer this maintenance to your authorized Suzuki Dealer.

Haynes Manual: Remove the left side cover, right side cover, clutch, oil pump, starter motor, flywheel, drive sprocket, oil pan, crankshaft and rear headlight.
Clymer Manual: Follow the directions in the 24 8x10 glossy photographs with the circles and arrows on the front of each one telling what each one is all about.
Suzuki Manual: Unless you are experienced, refer this maintenance to your authorized Suzuki Dealer.

Haynes Manual: Remove the thrust washer. It is called a thrust washer because the spring behind it will thrust it across the garage and under whatever is hardest for you to move.
Clymer Manual: Follow the directions in the 24 8x10 glossy photographs with the circles and arrows on the front of each one telling what each one is all about.
Suzuki Manual: Unless you are experienced, refer this maintenance to your authorized Suzuki Dealer.

Remove the Mishkinish Modulator and Frammis Valve for inspection:
Haynes: Special tool ALDFJAL7343KLDLAL-ALDJFLKAD required.
Clymer: Special tool required, but you can easily make one using a rock, some paper, and a pair of scissors.
Suzuki Manual: Unless you are experienced, refer this maintenance to your authorized Suzuki Dealer.

Inspect the Mishkinish Modulator and Frammis Valve for abnomal wear according the following limits. Repair or replace as needed:
Haynes: Between 0.003 inches and 10.4 mm.
Clymer: 14.2 volts at 5000 RPM.
Suzuki Manual: Unless you are experienced, refer this maintenance to your authorized Suzuki Dealer.

Re-assemble the engine in the reverse order.
Haynes: Lubricate all fasteners liberally. Torque to values on page 47 of 40 later in this manual.
Clymer: Use red Loctite on all fasteners. See your authorized Suzuki dealer for the correct torque values.
Suzuki Manual: Unless you are experienced, refer this maintenance to your authorized Suzuki Dealer.

Wonder if BassCliff would want to add this to his Web Page???

 

[Steve]

 

[chuckycheese]

Cute!

Cute!

That's very clever, Tomm!!\\/

 

[catbed]

Instructions below:

The Mishkinish Modulator works with the Frammis Valve to limit saddle time. The two components should be inspected and / or replaced whenever the motorcycle is running perfectly, or every 11.26 miles, whichever occurs first.

WARNING: Do not attempt this procedure unless: 1) It is either a Saturday or a Sunday. 2) The temperature is between 65 and 80 degress F, and 3) the weather is either sunny or mostly sunny.

These parts are located in the transmission between the 3rd and 4th driven gears.
Haynes Manual: Some minor dissassembly required.
Clymer Manual: Follow the directions in the 24 8x10 glossy photographs with the circles and arrows on the front of each one telling what each one is all about.
Suzuki Manual: Unless you are experienced, refer this maintenance to your authorized Suzuki Dealer.

Haynes Manual: Remove the left side cover, right side cover, clutch, oil pump, starter motor, flywheel, drive sprocket, oil pan, crankshaft and rear headlight.
Clymer Manual: Follow the directions in the 24 8x10 glossy photographs with the circles and arrows on the front of each one telling what each one is all about.
Suzuki Manual: Unless you are experienced, refer this maintenance to your authorized Suzuki Dealer.

Haynes Manual: Remove the thrust washer. It is called a thrust washer because the spring behind it will thrust it across the garage and under whatever is hardest for you to move.
Clymer Manual: Follow the directions in the 24 8x10 glossy photographs with the circles and arrows on the front of each one telling what each one is all about.
Suzuki Manual: Unless you are experienced, refer this maintenance to your authorized Suzuki Dealer.

Remove the Mishkinish Modulator and Frammis Valve for inspection:
Haynes: Special tool ALDFJAL7343KLDLAL-ALDJFLKAD required.
Clymer: Special tool required, but you can easily make one using a rock, some paper, and a pair of scissors.
Suzuki Manual: Unless you are experienced, refer this maintenance to your authorized Suzuki Dealer.

Inspect the Mishkinish Modulator and Frammis Valve for abnomal wear according the following limits. Repair or replace as needed:
Haynes: Between 0.003 inches and 10.4 mm.
Clymer: 14.2 volts at 5000 RPM.
Suzuki Manual: Unless you are experienced, refer this maintenance to your authorized Suzuki Dealer.

Re-assemble the engine in the reverse order.
Haynes: Lubricate all fasteners liberally. Torque to values on page 47 of 40 later in this manual.
Clymer: Use red Loctite on all fasteners. See your authorized Suzuki dealer for the correct torque values.
Suzuki Manual: Unless you are experienced, refer this maintenance to your authorized Suzuki Dealer.

Wonder if BassCliff would want to add this to his Web Page???

great song!

 

[Killer2600]

Instructions below:

The Mishkinish Modulator works with the Frammis Valve to limit saddle time. The two components should be inspected and / or replaced whenever the motorcycle is running perfectly, or every 11.26 miles, whichever occurs first.

My bike is running perfectly, how long do I have to inspect/replace those before my bike runs like sh1t? \\/

 

[doctorgonzo]

hardest part of my 3 inch thick suzuki manula is finding stuff because of the 11 supplements one for the E, one for the G, one for the S, one for the GL, etc...

 

[flyingace]

I'll throw in my $.02

A manual that would adequately detail every step to every proceedure with enough color illustrations to make it idiot proof would be 4 feet thick and cost $1000.

I've used the 'crappy' Haynes manual for 3 years, and it has the necessary information to do any job IF I HAVE ADEQUATE BACKGROUND KNOWLEDGE of what I'm are trying to do. The reason so many think all manuals 'suck' is because they don't do any homework gathering the necessary knowldege to use the manual properly. They expect the manual to fill all those gaps after they've already started.

Read books, search the WEB, figure out not just the steps to take, but the reasons for those steps. An hour of research can save 10 hours of frustration.