Transmission/Drivetrain issues....

[bluedawgie]

Thanks, Nessim. Strong suggestion taken solemnly. That is my plan. Not only for economical reasons, but I just love the satisfaction of doing-it-myself, with some help from my friends. I was chatting with another friend living in my hometown here, and he did a complete resto. on a 1969 Honda CB 750K to almost concours condition. It is just absolutely beautiful. Spent about 10 grand, and that includes doing a lot of work himself. Of course, my wife doesn't understand my sentimentality of this whole thing....her thinking is take the money and buy a better bike.
Now who's being irrational?

[bluedawgie]

Oh, incidentally.....and I am not plugging this because I'm a distributor...(just doing it for a hobby)but I am an Amsoil guy,so I'm sorta biased when it comes to lubricants.

[Steve]

Thanks....yeah, I guess that would help also, wouldn't it?
I live in a 'burb on the SW side of Columbus, Ohio.

OH, BOY!! Another one within striking distance (once I make it home again).
(Grove City is where I got "Junior". )

Hope you get it figured out, because the weather just might look like this by the time I make it home in mid-November.

Feel free to contact me for help, though.

.

[bluedawgie]

Awesome, Steve. I see you've got a Yamaha Royale in the family.
A buddy of mine from the Buckeye Lake area rides one, along with a Boss Hoss. Hope you make it home safe and sound.
Incidentally, a bunch of us (about a dozen) were planning to going on our annual River Ride last Sunday. They went, and I stayed home due to my "whatever" issue. Would love to go on the Friends of Hocking Hills Poker Run, (Oct.3) but it all depends on if I can get my baby repaired in time.

[Larry D]

Larry, I see you're from Indianapolis. When I get my baby up and running again, would you mind if I rode over your way for a cup 'o' java. I'll buy.
My best friend lives in Marion, and I was threatening to ride over and visit him, (along with a pummeling for not calling me for years)and if you don't mind we could get in a few miles together. Just a thought.
Hopefully, it'll be before the snow flies...lol.

Sure, just get ahold of me here, if you head this way.

[bluedawgie]

Well, I managed to pull the rear wheel. That went fairly well. I did have a little bit of an issue with the height of the rear fender when trying to remove the tire. I ended up putting a floor jack under the center stand, raising it up, and sliding a couple of 2x4's I had handily laying around, under the stand. That was only real issue, oh....along with having to go purchase a 12 pt. 24 mm. closed end wrench to remove the axle retaining nut on the left side. My standard set only went up to 21 mm. The splined gears looked good. Blew them off with air, and sprayed some degreaser on them to clean them up. No missing teeth on either side. I tried to move the driveshaft, but it still only moved just slightly. Guess it's time to move on up the shaft area. I'm thinking about separating the drive train at the rubber protective boot area. If it moves freely after that, then the issue is most likely within the transmission somewhere. Oh, I didn't take apart the rear hub assembly. Curious as to what's in there. <g>

[rustybronco]

Take the three nuts and washers off the rear differential, then remove it. it should take you all of 5 minutes. keeping mindful of all the spacers in there proper order. then you will be able to turn the input and see if the driven gear (the thing that drives the spline) rotates smoothly.

there also is a small vent hole on the wheel side of the differential near the top. fluid will leak out of it if the differential is turned upside down.

did you inspect the rear wheel bearings for smoothness of rotation?

[bluedawgie]

Thanks, Rusty.....I was reading my service manual last night about the rear hub and drive train assembly and it made me a little nervous. I realize I'm simply looking for the "bind" in the mechanism, but it was talking about different shim measurements, gear meshing tolerances, and so on.
Honestly, it was a little intimidating. I think partly was because it was getting to be late, and I was tired. Then my wife, bless her heart, is saying, just take it to the shop and let HIM fix it. Reminds me back to the story of Adam and Eve in the garden....with Eve tempting Adam to give in to temptation. Well, I'm pressing onward. My thinking is if I really "bugger" this up, my mechanic is gonna get a basket full of parts from a guy with a silly embarrassing grin on his face...lol.
I remember when I was trying to change the fuel pump on our Dodge Intrepid. I told my auto mechanic about it. He said, "You've got guts, buddy...'cause even I don't like to do THAT" I replied...."I prefer to call it just stubborn foolishness...lol" Well, thanks again for your input. Hopefully, someday I'll be able to help someone else on here with similar problems.
Oh, btw....I mentioned earlier about buying a backup bike....I couldn't believe the ad that I saw....something's gotta be wrong here.
http://wisconsin.freecycleshopper.co...cade-1400.html I'm at least going to inquire about it.

[rustybronco]

Thanks, Rusty.....I was reading my service manual last night about the rear hub and drive train assembly and it made me a little nervous. I realize I'm simply looking for the "bind" in the mechanism, but it was talking about different shim measurements, gear meshing tolerances, and so on.
Honestly, it was a little intimidating. I think partly was because it was getting to be late, and I was tired. Then my wife, bless her heart, is saying, just take it to the shop and let HIM fix it.

Those shims are inside the "third member" (engine>trans>axle). those shims have nothing to do with removal of the rear differential. all you are doing is removing the rear diff's attaching hardware (three nuts and washers), then pulling it rearward off the drive shaft. the drive shaft has a male spline which goes into the female spline of the diff.

to re-install it, wipe a little silicone sealer on the front where it meets the swing arm, grease the splines and bolt 'er back up...

The splined gears looked good. Blew them off with air, and sprayed some degreaser on them to clean them up. No missing teeth on either side.

Can you see the complete length of the teeth?

if the diff checks out Okay, leave off the diff and un-clamp the drive shaft boot.

[tom203]

Don't get intimidated by shims and gear meshing stuff at this point- you're looking for something obvious! You can fine tune it later! We're all here to help- the combined experience will guide you. Relax, let's find out what part failed before we drag the bike off.
You said it in your first post- wear and tear! Thirty year olds need maintenance- I know I did at that age!

[bluedawgie]

Oakley, dokley....I managed to pull off the "pumpkin" differential hub assembly....and I rotated the spline gear....it does not bind. At first I was kinda hopeful,
because it didn't at first, but I gave it a little better squeeze with my fingers and it started to rotate freely. Well, I guess we'll just move on up the drivetrain. I'm going to disconnect the boot next, as instructed. Should I remove the swing arm to get a better look at it?

[tom203]

Oakley, dokley....I managed to pull off the "pumpkin" differential hub assembly....and I rotated the spline gear....it does not bind. At first I was kinda hopeful,
because it didn't at first, but I gave it a little better squeeze with my fingers and it started to rotate freely. Well, I guess we'll just move on up the drivetrain. I'm going to disconnect the boot next, as instructed. Should I remove the swing arm to get a better look at it?

Gung ho! allright! While you're pulling stuff off, make sure that however the bike is being supported stays nice and safe!
You described a ticking ? noise before this lockup, but the noise went away at a stoplight, then returned just before the grand finale. Sounds like output shaft or bevel gear stuff, but I 've yet to open one of these up, but others have and will offer guidance shortly. Good job!

[bluedawgie]

Thanks, Tom......sometimes I tend to get a little impatient with my work.
When I was trying to get the back wheel off, I had a clearance issue and had to raise the bike up about 4 inches. This method is definitely not recommended, but it's what I had at the time. I used the small car hydraulic floor under the center stand, with one hand steadying the bike, and the other pumping the jack, while squatting. Definitely not the safest way to do that! I had a couple of small cut pieces of 2"x4" that I slid under each foot. Whew! I got the wheel out, lifted it a little, took the wood pieces back out. It is now back on the floor, with a plastic cooler supporting one side in the rear for stability. I was thinking about getting one of those cheap Sears motorcycle stands. I guess they normally run about $120. For now, I just kinda improvise with "things" I can find laying around the garage. Eventually, I would like to get a really nice motorcycle lift, but that's a little further "on down the road" yet. For now, it seems pretty safe and stable for what I'm doing.

[rustybronco]

First of all, in the bikes tool kit there is a cable that has two hooks, one on either end. it's purpose when used with the supplied lever, is to collapse the front forks allowing the rear of the bike to rise, making for an easier rear wheel removal. lacking that, before you put the on the center stand, put a one inch board under it. the board under the stand effectively raises the rear of the bike, combined with angling the rear wheel off to one side when removing it, will get the job done also.

on to the problem...

at this point I would drain the fluids in the engines secondary drive and the third member and check for unusual metal bits before going to much further.

after that, I would remove the right hand "points" cover, put a 3/4 inch wrench on the large nut and turn it clockwise, making sure it's in neutral. then loosen the clamp on the boot, then put a wrench on the bolts and turn the drive shaft; feeling for roughness or lockup when turning it. I would also suggest you re-visit the pumkin and do the same to it before removing the boot.

I rotated the spline gear....it does not bind. At first I was kinda hopeful,
because it didn't at first, but I gave it a little better squeeze with my fingers and it started to rotate freely.

keep in mind, the piece causing the lockup may have gotten "unlodged" at anytime.

[bluedawgie]

Thanks Rusty for the tool kit tip. I didn't get an owners manual, and haven't really looked over the tools to see what came with it.
I did drain the fluids in the secondary, the "hub" and the transmission area...(main) but I didn't think to be looking for metal pieces. My intention for draining was to replace the fluids with all synthetic. (Amsoil enthusiast) I'll give the hub some more turns, also moving the shaft with the 3/4" wrench. I was going to try to remove the boot also, or at least disconnect the retainer to get a good look at it, as I'm turning things.