Auto Start??????

[Jd Powell]

you are not dealing with a short unless you are blowing fuses. what you have is a start circuit where the control has been bypassed at some point by either a path to ground or as preveously mentioned a stuck solenoid. now since the starter cutout (clutch switch) is working to control the circuit the problem is in the low current switch circuit.find the g/y wire that goes from the start button to the clutch switch and see if it has power when the key is on. (black meter lead on neg battery terminal red lead on wire being checked for voltage)the clutch switch should NOT recive any power until you have pushed in the start button if you have power check both the start button and the engine stop switch as the stop switch controls power to the start button, as well as the coils and ign ignitor unit none of these should have power with the engine stop switch in the off position also check all the connectors in between as the switches wont do a thing if a connector has melted and bypassed the switches. good luck.

[devildogGS850]

Ok, just to clarify....my next step is to check the g/y wire that goes from the starter button to the clutch switch. There should be no power coming from that wire unless I'm actually pressing the starter button.

I replaced the solenoid this morning, and there wire two wires (each one connected to one pole of the solenoid). In addition there was a ground wire, and a third wire that was soldered to the old solenoid (the new one had a third smaller post with a hole through it). Is this somehow connected to this problem? I rewired the new solenoid exactly as the old had been.

I'm just having a hard time wrapping my brain around this...everything, clutch safety switch and starter button were working fine one second, and then all of the sudden...not. I would understand if I was having problem with a bike I just took delivery of and would suspect that there had been some half-assed rewiring done, but everything has been working like a charm for the last month, and then suddenly its as if my bike rewired itself in the middle of the night.

[devildogGS850]

what you have is a start circuit where the control has been bypassed at some point by either a path to ground or as preveously mentioned a stuck solenoid. now since the starter cutout (clutch switch) is working to control the circuit the problem is in the low current switch circuit.find the g/y wire that goes from the start button to the clutch switch and see if it has power when the key is on. (black meter lead on neg battery terminal red lead on wire being checked for voltage)the clutch switch should NOT recive any power until you have pushed in the start button if you have power check both the start button and the engine stop switch as the stop switch controls power to the start button, as well as the coils and ign ignitor unit none of these should have power with the engine stop switch in the off position also check all the connectors in between as the switches wont do a thing if a connector has melted and bypassed the switches. good luck.

Since I have replaced the solenoid, I believe I can rule that out...and I am not blowing any fuses. Sounds like the engine stop switch??? The bike still runs once it starts though...could it be the engine stop switch if that is the case. If so...where is the engine stop switch? If that switch is bad, would the bike still start and run perfectly (just not start in a manner I would like?)

[devildogGS850]

Starter Disconnect Switch?

In looking through my wiring diagram in the shop manual, I noticed something called the starter disconnect switch. I guess logic would dictate that if this switch was bad, the starter could continually be stuck "on" but only fire when the clutch safety allows it (when the clutch is squeezed...seems like a logical place to look except that I have no clue where it is....any thoughts?

[mf70]

A few points:

you are not dealing with a short unless you are blowing fuses.

Well, the wiring harness has a lot of wires going to and fro; if two of the wrong wires touch, you'll get surprising behavior. It's not necessarily a short to ground, but the electrons are traveling a SHORTer path than intended.

In looking through my wiring diagram in the shop manual

That's the path to a resolution. While looking at the diagram, follow the current path in the starter circuit. Think about when each wire will be energized. (I found it helpful to give some wiring legs names, as in computer wiring practice, such as "switched main supply bus.") Test incrementally to make sure the real electrons are doing what you imagined they would do. Don't forget that the problem can be IN the harness, not just at one of the switches.

[chef1366]

If everything ran fine prior to the problkem I wonder if there's a chance you either hooked the solenoid up wrong or got a bad one.

[longgreensilverado]

here's another thought: i had a few weird electrical problems thruought last summer including my bike dieing intermittantly. It turned out to be many(all) of my wires going around the steering area to the controls. they simply broke down after time inside the housing and all made contact with each other. i ended up replacing both left and right controls and wiring harness. look under your tank and around your steering.

[txironhead]

I've always wondered if there was a better way to route wires than through the headlight. You've got a lot of flexing in the wires there. I realize that you've got a lot of switches, lights, etc. in that general area so the idea's probably moot, but it gives a lot of credence to the "minimalist" viewpoint (no blinkers, gauges, etc.). I'm still going to run all of that stuff, but other than replacing the wires in that area every few years I don't see how to keep problems from happening in that area.

[rustybronco]

you've got power being supplied to the clutch switch by-passing the the starter button, when it should go through start button first (or bad start button contacts still), then to the clutch switch, then to the starter solenoid. check the wiring for a cross connection.
you've got 12 volts being applied were it should not be.
disconnect the start button wiring and see if the problem is still there.

It's a pretty simple system, the 12v goes to the ignition switch (you said it doesn't crank with the ignition switch off so the ign switch is good) then to the start button, then the clutch switch, then the solenoid. it's most likely the start button/switch that's bad (it didn't do it before correct?).
don't cobble it unless you want to join the ranks of being a hack PO...

[devildogGS850]

I think your absolutely right. After removing the tank, checking wires, etc., the bottom line is that the clutch switch is getting power when it shouldn't be...its acting like the starter button is being pressed when it isn't. I dissassembled the switch itself and it looks ok, although I have nothing to compare it to to be honest. However, right before the wires for the starter button and kill switch enter the housing on the right grip, the wires were threaded in between the mounting brackets for the rear view mirror and smashed flat. I'm going to cut out the bad section of wire, solder the ends back into the starter button circuit and see if that doesn't solve the problem.

[rustybronco]

Check it with an v.o.m. (volt ohm meter) first. or use 12v and a 12v light bulb for a continuity test with the switch out of the circuit. do you have a test light? leave power to the start switch and disconnect the lead going to the clutch switch.
if the copper wire is not damaged shrink tube it instead.

[devildogGS850]

I wonder if you could explain this a little more before I dig myself any deeper by snipping wires.

There is an orange (#1) and orange/white (#2) wire coming into the starter switch. As I read the wiring diagram that is the power to the starter button. There is also a green/yellow wire (#3) from the starter button to the clutch safety switch. And finally another g/y wire (#4) from the clutch safety to the solenoid.

So a total of four wires.

I know #4 is good.

[rustybronco]

check your in box...

[devildogGS850]

Problem solved!

The green and yellow wire that runs between the starter button and the clutch safety was fried from being pinched in between the rear view mirror mount and the handlebar. Not sure why that would have cause the clutch safety to start the bike, but at this point, I don;t care...its fixed.

Of course I did about 4 hours of disassembly that turned out to be unnecessary, but such is the nature of electrical problems I guess.

Thank you all very much for all of your help!

[jimcor]

The green and yellow wire that runs between the starter button and the clutch safety was fried from being pinched in between the rear view mirror mount and the handlebar. Not sure why that would have cause the clutch safety to start the bike, but at this point, I don;t care...its fixed.

Of course I did about 4 hours of disassembly that turned out to be unnecessary, but such is the nature of electrical problems I guess.

Thank you all very much for all of your help!

Thank you for getting it fixed!

Like many I've been watching this to find out how it turned out!

Another GSR victory!