Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

valve shims, where get the X sizes?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    valve shims, where get the X sizes?

    - I gather that the GS shims are the 29.5mm diameter.

    - I see bike bandit lists shims (Suzuki OEM I assume, and does not stat the diameter) for about $12 a piece.

    - I see that Z-1 has the 29.5mm shims that state in description are for various Suzuki GS's. And I gather their shims are the an aftermarket brand (same as the kits I guess, dont recall at the moment the name) but are just under $5 each. I would assume they are acceptable.

    -I understand that don't really need the X sizes to adjust within spec (the spec range is .05 wide, and the standard step of the shims is .05). Only really need them if want to have all the clearances adjusted to all be about the about the same portion of the range, say want them all "loose" in the upper part of the range, or maybe want them all in the middle part of the range, or want them all in tight part of the range so open valve that little bit more. (am not intending for this to be a disscussion of if should be loose or tight or either).

    - And I understand that X means half size, that means for example; that a 255X is not 2.55mm but is about half way to the 260, so about 2.57mm (2.575 maybe).

    All the above is not a question, but I state just for verification.

    My question is: Where does one get the X or half size ones?

    None of the several places I looked listed any X size. Although on the OEM fissche (82 1100G) there did seem to be two part numbers listed for each size, but the descriptions where the same for each of the two part numbers per size, maybe the X got truncated off the description of one of the two (or maybe I am missing something else).

    Again, asking who carrys the X sizes (and for a good price to buy a handfull, not an entire kit).

    .

    <<<Later note, or story of my ignorance:
    I did not know about these X sizes a couple years ago when I did a valve clearance adjustment. Which might explain why I had some trouble when I measured my clearance(s), took out the existing shim(s), and ordered replacement shim(s), installed the new shim(s). And some of the clearances did not come out to what I was expecting (yes, I rolled the engine over a few times to squish out oil and settle things). Now I see that some of the shims I took out a couple years ago where the X's, and I did not know what that meant at the time.

    .
    Last edited by Redman; 01-21-2010, 02:16 PM. Reason: add later note
    http://webpages.charter.net/ddvrnr/GS850_1100_Emblems.jpg
    Had 850G for 14 years. Now have GK since 2005.
    GK at IndyMotoGP Suzuki Display... ... GK on GSResources Page ... ... Euro Trash Ego Machine .. ..3 mo'cykls.... update 2 mocykl


    https://imgur.com/YTMtgq4

    #2
    Yeah, the x sizes are .02-.03mm larger than the non-x. Unfortunately, nobody that I know of sells the x sizes - and that's been pretty consistent across all the vendors and threads on the subject I've looked at. You can check with local mechanics or shops to see if they have any x's for exchange, or get in touch with the shim club.

    I have a couple of 2.7x shims if you're interested (they mic out to 2.73). PM me if you want 'em.

    Comment


      #3
      If you sell parts or provide services for GS series motorcycles, place a description of it in this forum.

      CURRENT INVENTORY

      2.15=0 2.16=0 2.17=0 2.18=0 2.19=0 = 0
      2.20=4 2.21=0 2.22=0 2.23=0 2.24=0 2.25=0 2.26=0 2.27=1 2.28=1 2.29=0 = 6
      2.30=7 2.31=0 2.32=0 2.33=0 2.34=1 2.35=2 2.36=0 2.37=1 2.38=2 2.39=0 = 13
      2.40=6 2.41=0 2.42=0 2.43=0 2.44=1 2.45=2 2.46=0 2.47=0 2.48=0 2.49=0 = 9
      2.50=6 2.51=1 2.52=0 2.53=0 2.54=2 2.55=5 2.56=2 2.57=2 2.58=6 2.59=4 = 28
      2.60=38 2.61=7 2.62=7 2.63=11 2.64=7 2.65=26 2.66=9 2.67=0 2.68=3 2.69=20=130
      2.70=8 2.71=3 2.72=3 2.73=7 2.74=19 2.75=18 2.76=1 2.77=4 2.78=3 2.79=4 = 69
      2.80=17 2.81=1 2.82=0 2.83=1 2.84=12 2.85=12 2.86=0 2.87=0 2.88=0 2.89=0 = 43
      2.90=7 3.05=2 = 9
      TOTAL SHIMS = 317
      De-stinking Penelope http://thegsresources.com/_forum/sho...d.php?t=179245

      http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...35#post1625535

      Comment


        #4
        If you have a micrometer (calipers are not accurate enough for this kind of check) and measure the shims you will find that they vary in thickness. Lacking X shims this is your best chance to get the clearance exactly where you want them.
        Ed

        To measure is to know.

        Mikuni O-ring Kits For Sale...https://www.thegsresources.com/_foru...ts#post1703182

        Top Newbie Mistakes thread...http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...d.php?t=171846

        Carb rebuild tutorial...https://gsarchive.bwringer.com/mtsac...d_Tutorial.pdf

        KZ750E Rebuild Thread...http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...0-Resurrection

        Comment


          #5
          As noted above, you can not order X shims from a store. You pretty much have to "luck" into them by watching eBay for shims, getting a new head that still has shims, finding a friend that has some, contacting the GS Shim Club, whatever.

          I have used the shims from Z1 with no problem. Can't say they are of any less quality. In fact, the only thing I have noticed that is different is the edge of the shim. OEM shims have a bit of a chamfer, the Z1 shims have a square edge. The price is right (currently just over $5, at $5.28) and service is quick. Just can't beat that combination.

          As far as clearance, yeah, technically anything within the stated specs is good. After all, that's why the specs exist. In practicality, adjusting toward the looser end or just barely outside spec will give longer service intervals. If you are racing, keeping them at minimum specs will maximize valve lift for more air flow, meaning more power. Loosening the valves a bit will reduce peak power ever so slightly, but will move the torque peak a little lower in the powerband, which makes it a bit friendlier for street use.

          One other possible source of X shims is your local Suzuki shop. See if you can sweet talk the parts person or the old mechanic into checking their parts box. They usually have a box of "old" shims that they sometimes use when doing a tune-up on a bike.

          .
          sigpic
          mine: 2000 Honda GoldWing GL1500SE and 1980 GS850G'K' "Junior"
          hers: 1982 GS850GL - "Angel" and 1969 Suzuki T250 Scrambler
          #1 son: 1986 Yamaha Venture Royale 1300 and 1982 GS650GL "Rat Bagger"
          #2 son: 1980 GS1000G
          Family Portrait
          Siblings and Spouses
          Mom's first ride
          Want a copy of my valve adjust spreadsheet for your 2-valve per cylinder engine? Send me an e-mail request (not a PM)
          (Click on my username in the upper-left corner for e-mail info.)

          Comment


            #6
            I have no probs getting accurate measurement on these with calipers...

            but then I have a very expensive set of Japanese calipers not your $9 Harbor freight jobs...

            Dan
            1980 GS1000G - Sold
            1978 GS1000E - Finished!
            1980 GS550E - Fixed & given to a friend
            1983 GS750ES Special - Sold
            2009 KLR 650 - Sold - gone to TX!
            1982 GS1100G - Rebuilt and finished. - Sold
            2009 TE610 - Dual Sporting around dreaming of Dakar..... - FOR SALE!

            www.parasiticsanalytics.com

            TWINPOT BRAKE UPGRADE LINKY: http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...e-on-78-Skunk/

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by salty_monk View Post
              I have no probs getting accurate measurement on these with calipers...

              but then I have a very expensive set of Japanese calipers not your $9 Harbor freight jobs...

              Dan
              I 2nd that.
              I have an older set of these http://ep.yimg.com/ca/I/pgiinc_2086_34114381
              De-stinking Penelope http://thegsresources.com/_forum/sho...d.php?t=179245

              http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...35#post1625535

              Comment


                #8
                Snap. Mine are Mitutoyo too but mine are the digital ones. I acquired them from a previous job.

                Dan
                1980 GS1000G - Sold
                1978 GS1000E - Finished!
                1980 GS550E - Fixed & given to a friend
                1983 GS750ES Special - Sold
                2009 KLR 650 - Sold - gone to TX!
                1982 GS1100G - Rebuilt and finished. - Sold
                2009 TE610 - Dual Sporting around dreaming of Dakar..... - FOR SALE!

                www.parasiticsanalytics.com

                TWINPOT BRAKE UPGRADE LINKY: http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...e-on-78-Skunk/

                Comment


                  #9
                  I have a cheap, chinese-made digital caliper - but it was dead on with the micrometer when I measured all my shims. They were both within .01mm of the printed size.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Redman View Post
                    -
                    ...
                    ...
                    asking who carrys the X sizes
                    ...
                    ....
                    So, if I Understand properly: the answer to "where" to order the X size shims is "nowhere".
                    They are not sold thru suppliers. Appartently Can be found only by someone who has taken one out of an engine. So, then, it seems that any X size shim must be a factory stock installed shim.

                    .
                    http://webpages.charter.net/ddvrnr/GS850_1100_Emblems.jpg
                    Had 850G for 14 years. Now have GK since 2005.
                    GK at IndyMotoGP Suzuki Display... ... GK on GSResources Page ... ... Euro Trash Ego Machine .. ..3 mo'cykls.... update 2 mocykl


                    https://imgur.com/YTMtgq4

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Yep, yep, and you're right.

                      .
                      sigpic
                      mine: 2000 Honda GoldWing GL1500SE and 1980 GS850G'K' "Junior"
                      hers: 1982 GS850GL - "Angel" and 1969 Suzuki T250 Scrambler
                      #1 son: 1986 Yamaha Venture Royale 1300 and 1982 GS650GL "Rat Bagger"
                      #2 son: 1980 GS1000G
                      Family Portrait
                      Siblings and Spouses
                      Mom's first ride
                      Want a copy of my valve adjust spreadsheet for your 2-valve per cylinder engine? Send me an e-mail request (not a PM)
                      (Click on my username in the upper-left corner for e-mail info.)

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Redman View Post
                        So, if I Understand properly: the answer to "where" to order the X size shims is "nowhere".
                        They are not sold thru suppliers. Appartently Can be found only by someone who has taken one out of an engine. So, then, it seems that any X size shim must be a factory stock installed shim.

                        .
                        I've had more than a few X sizes in my hands for the 8 valve bikes I've adjusted, but have freely traded some of them off for regular sizes either at the dealer or here on the forum.
                        If they're discontinued and "collector's items" then maybe I should have asked for 2 in return?
                        Anyway, I usually can match regular sizes up fine with a little shuffling to get somewhere between .038(my smallest feeler gauge) - .09mm (slightly over spec).

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by Redman View Post
                          So, if I Understand properly: the answer to "where" to order the X size shims is "nowhere".
                          They are not sold thru suppliers. Appartently Can be found only by someone who has taken one out of an engine. So, then, it seems that any X size shim must be a factory stock installed shim.

                          .
                          Yup, that's it -- they were installed only at the factory. I suspect it's mostly Suzuki's way of using up out-of-spec shims. But if you have a good selection of them, they're nice to use sometimes. As you saw in my shim kit, I've collected quite a few over the years.

                          On later engines, like the GS500, these shims are marked with a measurement instead of an "x"; for example, "2.78" instead of "2.75x".

                          When in doubt, go with the smaller shim/bigger clearance. I've set clearances as high as .13mm (about .005") before (didn't have the size I needed at the moment) with no detectable added noises or problems. Keep in mind that GS valve clearance specs are extremely small compared to most engines.
                          1983 GS850G, Cosmos Blue.
                          2005 KLR685, Aztec Pink - Turd II.3, the ReReReTurdening
                          2015 Yamaha FJ-09, Magma Red Power Corrupts...
                          Eat more venison.

                          Please provide details. The GSR Hive Mind is nearly omniscient, but not yet clairvoyant.

                          Celeriter equita, converteque saepe.

                          SUPPORT THIS SITE! DONATE TODAY!

                          Co-host of "The Riding Obsession" sport-touring motorcycling podcast at tro.bike!

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by bwringer View Post
                            ....
                            .....
                            As you saw in my shim kit, I've collected quite a few over the years.
                            ....
                            ....
                            Yep, Brain, I saw that, the kit was nice. And I thank you. I would have mentioned it more specifically sooner, but was not going to advertise this kit. Sure was nice to just have what size was needed right there on the spot, rather than have to order and wait several days (like I did a couple years ago).

                            Saturday, I added the 5 or 6 (that I had from a couple years ago) to the kit.

                            And then later I (should say "we") swapped out 3 from the bike that needed to be adjusted. And in doing so depleted the kits supply of two different sizes, and are two other sizes that the kit did not have.

                            And, of the four sizes missing, two are the X size. BUt now that I review my notes, it was not the X sizes that I took out of the kit. Okay, I feel better now.


                            .
                            http://webpages.charter.net/ddvrnr/GS850_1100_Emblems.jpg
                            Had 850G for 14 years. Now have GK since 2005.
                            GK at IndyMotoGP Suzuki Display... ... GK on GSResources Page ... ... Euro Trash Ego Machine .. ..3 mo'cykls.... update 2 mocykl


                            https://imgur.com/YTMtgq4

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by Steve View Post
                              Yep, yep, and you're right.

                              .
                              Thanks.

                              .
                              http://webpages.charter.net/ddvrnr/GS850_1100_Emblems.jpg
                              Had 850G for 14 years. Now have GK since 2005.
                              GK at IndyMotoGP Suzuki Display... ... GK on GSResources Page ... ... Euro Trash Ego Machine .. ..3 mo'cykls.... update 2 mocykl


                              https://imgur.com/YTMtgq4

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X