BanditRE's GS850

[BanditRE]

Ignition parts came in. New Coils, new plug leads and a new Dyna S electronic ignition System. Almost $300 from Z1 for all that. I had one bad coil already, and very badly pitted points. I could have kept the old ignition system, but things are much simpler with electronic, so I made the call and spent the money. The only additional tool I needed was the crimping tool that Z1 sells. I have a set of crimps but unfortunately not one that would work on 7-8mm spark plug lead fittings.

The old coils came off along with old wires.


And the new Dyna 3 Ohm coils went on. Fairly simple installation with the exception of getting the plug leads to fit to the new outlets from the coils. Its a tight space in there and it took a while to make it work. Cut the plug leads to length, installed, and everything fitted in, just barely.


The installation of the ignition system was a little trickier, mostly because I'm not good with electronics or electrical work, and because i don't think the Dyna instructions are very good at all. Thankfully, Stig Poulsen wrote up a How-To on CliffBike's page about installing this, and his photos and explanation were far better than Dyna's. So, thanks for that Stig, much appreciated. I eventually figured it out, installed the new rotor, new wiring and made the new connection for a 12v supply for the ignition.


With the kit that Dyna sent, the install was straightforward. The power supply splice was simple enough, and the new wiring from the ignition was just long enough to make it back to the original bullet connectors in the wiring harness by the battery box. It worked out and the install was pretty neat.


That was it for Saturday's work. Sunday, I can hopefully get it running, check the static timing and synch the carbs. Then its on to cleaning out the gas tank and rebuilding the petcock. I'll let you know how that goes next.

 

[twotimeGSr]

Nice photo! I love the front brakes.. Those is on my wish list.

 

[1948man]

Great thread. Congratulations. Inspirational to a reluctant wrench like me.

 

[BanditRE]

Thank you for the kind words. Its been a lot of fun working on this bike and making it run again. I wasn't sure when I started if I'd enjoy it, or if I'd have the will to finish it after the initial excitement wore off. I've had a grand time, and I'm ready to start think about what the next bike could be! If I do another one though, I've either got to sell this or sell the Enfield. Hmmm.

I got the time to get it running again today with new coils and ignition. It started right up, and idled pretty well. The timing was a little off, so I tweaked that so the idle timing and advance marks were per factory specs, set the idle back down and it sounds pretty darn good. I also hooked up the synch gauges, and eyeballing the adjustment during assembly after I cleaned them turned out to be far more accurate than I had thought it would be. The #1 carb needed a very small adjustment to match the other three carbs. Good stuff, I was pretty happy about that.

Got the cases all buttoned back up, reinstalled the crash bars, cleaned up the bike to get a years dust off it and called it quits.

All that's left now is to clean up the gas tank, rebuild the petcock and put the tank, seat and fairing back on. Then it should be (fingers crossed) time to ride it!

 

[BanditRE]

Last weekend and during this past week, I've disassembled the gas tank, soaked it in rust remover and rebuilt the petcock.

The petcock was leaking as the rubber parts were in pretty bad shape and the entire petcock was filled with a combination of what I assumed to be rust and gasoline varnish.


The sending unit wasn't looking much better.


Hmmmm yummy


Plugged up the tank holes as best I could using the write up from Cliffbikes pages. I had to use the petcock as a plug and I used the gas cap for periods as well as the pipe plug would leak badly when the tank was inverted. It worked though.


I used Metal Rescue which I bought from Home Depot. Evaporust wasn't available anywhere around here. I used 2 gallons of the stuff for inside the tank and cleaning the sending unit. $25 per gallon


I couldn't get a good picture of inside the tank, but it removed the rust and varnish and whatever kind of sealant the PO had used to try to seal the petcock. The sending unit turned out pretty well too


The only problem I had with the metal rescue was that while it removed rust and crud very effectively, it also removed wire insulation from the sending unit very effectively! So I had to remove the old wire, and solder a new piece of wire in its place. I had to research wire types a little to find what would be ok to use inside a tank full of gasoline. I let PVC wire sit in a bowl of gas for a few days and it appeared to have no effect on the plastic insulation. I asked the service manager at the local Ford dealership while I was there one day and he said he thought PVC wire was fine, but gave me an old sending unit out of a Taurus with the original wire still on it, so I used that! Soldered back in place and re-installed in the tank. Before installation, I washed out the tank with a few passes of fresh gas to remove and remnants of crud and cleaner. I reassembly the petcock with new rubber parts, except the diaphragm. They're on back order from Z1 I guess. I rebuilt it with old one and there's no leaking in 3 days, so I should be ok to use the old one for a little while at least. Here's the cleaned up tank and petcock.





All I have to do now, is fit the tank, fuel filter, seat, side covers and fairing, and this thing is done! Hopefully today. I bought this bike home a year ago today on Fathers Day. It'd be cool to finish it today too.

 

[Guest]

Some good results with the rust removal.

The end is in sight. Good luck.

 

[Weapon]

those covers look amazing!

 

[BanditRE]

Thanks guys. The rust remover did waste to the rust in about 24 hours, very impressive. I only wish the covers took that long!

Big day today. In between Father's Day festivities, I did manage to finally reassemble the bike. Its all finally in one piece! I didn't ride it today, I just basked in the glow of finishing. I have next week off so hopefully there'll be plenty of time for riding.

Fairing on....


Tank on.....


The final piece of the puzzle, the last side cover...


One whole bike again.


A big thank you to all of you helped out along the way, and all those who wrote how-to's on the CliffBike page. Without those, this would have taken much longer. Thank you very much.
There should soon be a few pics of this old girl out on the road for the first time since 2001.

 

[BanditRE]

A mostly non-eventful first ride. The clutch was a bit too tight, I had a small gas leak at the petcock I think (but I couldn't verify it when I got back home), and the speedo is acting a little weird. It gets up to speed but it takes a while to get there. I'm assuming the gauges are tight, so I'll see how it reacts over the next couple of rides, but if it doesn't get better I may have to dive into that a little. Does anyone know if there's a thread here that discusses mph to engine speed? Having never ridden this I have nothing to compare to. Once up to speed and the speedo settled, it was indicating about 3500 rpm at 50 mph. I was curious if that was about right.

Its good to see the sun on her....

 

[Guest]

A mostly non-eventful first ride.

They're the best kind.

Does anyone know if there's a thread here that discusses mph to engine speed? Having never ridden this I have nothing to compare to. Once up to speed and the speedo settled, it was indicating about 3500 rpm at 50 mph. I was curious if that was about right.

That sounds about right but I'd still be interested in this too, as my speedo only goes to 85.

Your 850 is looking so very sweet, I doff my cap in your general direction.

 

[BanditRE]

Thanks Cyrano. I searched the forum a little and the general idea I got was 3500 at 50 in top was about right. That puts it at about 14mph per 1000 rpm in 5th, so at 70mph it should be about 5k, 80 mph about 5700 rpm. I'll pay more attention next ride!

 

[eil]

Fantastic looking 850. You found this on craigslist, right? If so, I think I remember seeing the ad. And then your first post not long after. It's been fun following this thread. Enjoy the ride!

 

[BanditRE]

Fantastic looking 850. You found this on craigslist, right? If so, I think I remember seeing the ad. And then your first post not long after. It's been fun following this thread. Enjoy the ride!

Yes sir. Bought it from a nice guy in Dearborn two days before he moved out of State. He wasn't going to take it with him, so it would have been dumped as he'd had it for sale for weeks and weeks with no interest from anyone until I came along. It's been fun for me too!

 

[Guest]

Thanks Cyrano. I searched the forum a little and the general idea I got was 3500 at 50 in top was about right. That puts it at about 14mph per 1000 rpm in 5th, so at 70mph it should be about 5k, 80 mph about 5700 rpm. I'll pay more attention next ride!

Just been out for a sunny evening ridearound and noted that nob on 5,000 rpm gives me an indicated 75mph. Hope this helps.

 

[BanditRE]

Just been out for a sunny evening ridearound and noted that nob on 5,000 rpm gives me an indicated 75mph. Hope this helps.

That is a help, thanks.

 

[BanditRE]

Well things are going fairly well. The only issues I seem to have are a sticky speedo, the plugs are too light after running and the clutch isn't quite right.

I can order a colder plug set to see if that cures the problem, or I may need to richen the mix slightly, but I can that figured out.
The speedo looks like it may have to come apart to clean the inside of what I assume is gunk clogging the interior, causing the slow response to changes in speed.
The clutch seems to be more of a mystery:

If I adjust the clutch cable for the best shifting, there doesn't appear to be much free play. I'm not sure if that's a big deal really. Of more concern is the juddery feel as you slip the clutch in first gear pulling away. It disappears with additional engine speed and doesn't seem to be a problem in any other gear. The other problem is heat. The clutch cover and secondary cover are very hot after a ride. I'll have to get a thermometer to know for sure, but by the palm of the hand I'd say the clutch and secondary covers are hotter than the cylinders, if not then very close to the same temperature.

Maybe this is normal for a GS? I don't remember any other bike I've had in the past where the clutch and gearbox got this hot. I would assume at this point that the heat may well be affecting the shifting and clutch feel as well, but I'm just guessing. After a couple of hours of cooling down, the engine is warm but the clutch and secondary covers are still piping hot. This doesn't seem right.

Any comments are welcome, but I'm off the forum now.....

 

[Steve]

I can order a colder plug set to see if that cures the problem, or I may need to richen the mix slightly, ...

Colder (or hotter) plugs are not a cure for anything, they are just a Band-Aid that will cover up other problems.

If the plugs are white, you have a lean condition, so richen up the carbs.

Now, lean under what circumstances? You need to do proper plug chops to check each circuit in the carb to determine which one(s) you need to adjust.

If you install colder plugs on a lean-running engine, the engine will still run hotter than it should, and your plugs might foul out because they are not getting hot enough. It is MUCH better to get everything running correctly, with no Band-Aids. :encouragement:

.

 

[BanditRE]

Now, lean under what circumstances? You need to do proper plug chops to check each circuit in the carb to determine which one(s) you need to adjust.

If you install colder plugs on a lean-running engine, the engine will still run hotter than it should, and your plugs might foul out because they are not getting hot enough. It is MUCH better to get everything running correctly, with no Band-Aids. :encouragement:

.

Thanks Steve. I just got done re-reading the VM carb tutorial. I haven't been running the bike hard at all, just fairly low throttle openings for the most part, especially in the last few miles before shutting it down at home. I'll start with the idle circuit, with the pilot fuel screw I assume. Looks like the carbs have to come off the bike to adjust those, which is a bummer. I don't want band-aid fixes. I'll get it right sooner or later.

 

[Brendan W]

A mostly non-eventful first ride. The clutch was a bit too tight, I had a small gas leak at the petcock I think (but I couldn't verify it when I got back home), and the speedo is acting a little weird. It gets up to speed but it takes a while to get there. I'm assuming the gauges are tight, so I'll see how it reacts over the next couple of rides, but if it doesn't get better I may have to dive into that a little. Does anyone know if there's a thread here that discusses mph to engine speed? Having never ridden this I have nothing to compare to. Once up to speed and the speedo settled, it was indicating about 3500 rpm at 50 mph. I was curious if that was about right.

About the same as mine 3400 at 80 kph. Cold both be wrong I suppose
Lovely looking bike, well done.

 

[eil]

If I adjust the clutch cable for the best shifting, there doesn't appear to be much free play. I'm not sure if that's a big deal really. Of more concern is the juddery feel as you slip the clutch in first gear pulling away. It disappears with additional engine speed and doesn't seem to be a problem in any other gear. The other problem is heat. The clutch cover and secondary cover are very hot after a ride. I'll have to get a thermometer to know for sure, but by the palm of the hand I'd say the clutch and secondary covers are hotter than the cylinders, if not then very close to the same temperature.

Not sure I understand adjusting the cable "for the best shifting". There should always be a little bit of play in the clutch lever. If not, the clutch cable will always be taut which is bad for it, plus increased risk of clutch slip when you don't want it. I aim for about 1mm where the lever meets the perch.

If you have it adjusted where there is still a little play but it doesn't seem like the clutch is disengaging when you pull the lever all the way in, then there are two other possibilities:

1) Incorrect angle on the clutch pivot lever (or whatever it's called) on the clutch cover. I have mine such that it points straight forward when my clutch lever is about halfway in. If you have it too much to either side, the clutch won't disengage fully.

2) Warped clutch plates. This would also explain the "juddery" feel when slipping the clutch.

It's pretty normal for these bikes to get quite hot after a good run. The fins on the cylinders and head will cool down quicker than the rest of the engine because their job is to dissipate heat as quickly as possible.