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Cleaning my grounds

  • Thread starter Thread starter motokid837
  • Start date Start date
M

motokid837

Guest
Hoping this isn't a silly question....I've heard a number of times on here that being sure your grounds are good can save you a number of confusing Electrical problems. So I'd like to go through mine and clean them up for prevenative maintenance, and my starter cranks slow sometimes. So where are all my grounds located? I didn't see anything on BikeCliff...unless I wasn't looking hard enough! Thank you all.
 
Starter is grounded to the engine via its rear mounting bolts. may need to pull starter and clean the bottom of the contact areas and the pedestals the bolts go in.

The battery ground is in the area of the top of the tranny. Follow the lead down. Harness ground is usually at the bolts to the battery box. I clean the frame under the spacer then bolt goes thru and the bolt itself. Clean the loops and add some grease to them to prevent future corrosion...much like you add some grease to the car battery terminals to protect them.
 
chuck hahn said:
Starter is grounded to the engine via its rear mounting bolts. may need to pull starter and clean the bottom of the contact areas and the pedestals the bolts go in.

The battery ground is in the area of the top of the tranny. Follow the lead down. Harness ground is usually at the bolts to the battery box. I clean the frame under the spacer then bolt goes thru and the bolt itself. Clean the loops and add some grease to them to prevent future corrosion...much like you add some grease to the car battery terminals to protect them.
Click to expand...

Actually the starter ground does not pass through the frame. There are no critical ground points between the frame and the engine. Yes the starter is grounded to the engine but the return path is through the large cable ground going from the rear top of the transmission to the - battery terminal.
 
No ****t Sherlock...that what i said!!! the starter is grounded "TO THE ENGINE....." And simple common sense dictates the engine is grounded via the thick cable...which I also stated.
 
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"........ ground does not pass through the frame. There are no critical ground points between the frame and the engine."

Hook the positive clamp to your battery charger to the battery and put the negative clamp on any bolt anywhere on the frame and it completes the charging circuit. Based on your response, please explain to me how this can be...seeing the engine is the only thing with the black lead grounding it!!!!

Stop!!!! THINK!!!!!
 
Don't confuse electrical connectivity with normal ground path. By hooking up the charger in that fashion you're creating a new circuit loop. Just because something has continuity to the normal ground path doesn't mean that current normally flows through that component.

Think about this... If you connect the negative charger cable to your handlebars you'll also get charging on your battery. Does that mean that current normally flows through your handlebars?

I know it's a hard concept to grasp but ground loops can be a little tricky sometimes to visualize. Look at Jim's single point ground concept and it may make things a little clearer.
 
chuck hahn said:
No ****t Sherlock...that what i said!!! the starter is grounded "TO THE ENGINE....." And simple common sense dictates the engine is grounded via the thick cable...which I also stated.
Click to expand...


""........ ground does not pass through the frame. There are no critical ground points between the frame and the engine."

Hook the positive clamp to your battery charger to the battery and put the negative clamp on any bolt anywhere on the frame and it completes the charging circuit. Based on your response, please explain to me how this can be...seeing the engine is the only thing with the black lead grounding it!!!!

Stop!!!! THINK!!!!!"


whoaaa...chill Houston......
 
Electricity needs a conductor to flow from point A to point B..true enough. BUT your statement said there arent any significant ground points between the frame and engine..right???

AND the lead from the neg battery post goes to then top of the tranny and NOT to the frame...right??? So how does a pathway get created is my point. There MUST be some sort of connection from the engine to the frame otherwise the frame could not be used as a ground point. So what I am trying to make you see is that there ARE significant ground point ( connectivity points if you will ) from the engine to the frame...being the engine mounting bolts.

If the engine was rubber mounted then another cable would have to go from either the battery post to the frame or from the engine to the frame. But since its hard mounted the bolts do the job. Take out the bolts and slide a plastic shim between every spot the engine touches the frame and the frame is insulated and taken out of the equation.

And once the battery charger lead is hooked to the handlebars from the charger there has to be current flow to ground or it wouldnt work. And some bikes ( not necessarily our GSs ) DO required the switches ground via the metal wire retainers making contact with the bars.

Im no NASA scientist but I know what is required for the conductivity of an electrical current. And since the handlebars are bolted into the frame ...thus mechanically linked to the engine....then followed upstream thru the cable to the battery it ALL makes any point on the bike a potential grounding point.
 
Rob..he come behind me in many of my responses and quotes a post in his response. Then refutes what I posted and just says it in another way.

Then makes the statement to the effect that there arent any connections from the engine to the frame. I think another certain somebody ( also from Georgia) may have been reincarnated with a different screen name.
 
Ideally, I think Suzuki should have had the larger one to the engine to accomodate the heavy amp draw of the starter and then another lead off the negative to the battery box bolt. This would make a much stronger battery to frame situation in my opinion. One could always make a shorty cable and use a longer bolt and add a secondary jumper directly to the frame.
 
chuck hahn said:
Rob..he come behind me in many of my responses and quotes a post in his response. Then refutes what I posted and just says it in another way.

Then makes the statement to the effect that there arent any connections from the engine to the frame. I think another certain somebody ( also from Georgia) may have been reincarnated with a different screen name.
Click to expand...

Chuck, you're being a bit paranoid. Ever since I've been on this forum I've seen repeated cases where others have corrected others on any number of miscommunications. I've been corrected quite a few times. It just seems to be the norm when technical information is being presented. No need to get all bent out of shape.

No I'm not anyone else's persona. I joined back in 2013 and have been active since. Not sure who you're thinking of and really don't care. If you want, you can PM me and I'll verify who I am. We can talk if you want. It's up to you.
 
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See GS Charging Health in my Signature. There is a description of Single Point Grounding.

There is a simplified description of grounding . See if it makes sense.
 
chuck hahn said:
Electricity needs a conductor to flow from point A to point B..true enough. BUT your statement said there arent any significant ground points between the frame and engine..right???

AND the lead from the neg battery post goes to then top of the tranny and NOT to the frame...right??? So how does a pathway get created is my point. There MUST be some sort of connection from the engine to the frame otherwise the frame could not be used as a ground point. So what I am trying to make you see is that there ARE significant ground point ( connectivity points if you will ) from the engine to the frame...being the engine mounting bolts.

If the engine was rubber mounted then another cable would have to go from either the battery post to the frame or from the engine to the frame. But since its hard mounted the bolts do the job. Take out the bolts and slide a plastic shim between every spot the engine touches the frame and the frame is insulated and taken out of the equation.

And once the battery charger lead is hooked to the handlebars from the charger there has to be current flow to ground or it wouldnt work. And some bikes ( not necessarily our GSs ) DO required the switches ground via the metal wire retainers making contact with the bars.

Im no NASA scientist but I know what is required for the conductivity of an electrical current. And since the handlebars are bolted into the frame ...thus mechanically linked to the engine....then followed upstream thru the cable to the battery it ALL makes any point on the bike a potential grounding point.
Click to expand...

Don't confuse connectivity with normal ground paths. If I attach a cable to the engine or frame does any current flow through it just because it's connected? You can take the engine completely out of the frame and, as long as the standard ground wires are still in place, the engine will start and run normally. In fact I would argue that if you do have significant current flowing from the engine through the frame than one of the normal grounds paths is compromised.

I do concede that there is a current return path that goes through the frame, but not through the engine to frame mounts.
 
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chuck hahn said:
I think another certain somebody ( also from Georgia) may have been reincarnated with a different screen name.
Click to expand...

I have thought the same possibility from the beginning! Just TOO much of the same patterns in his posts. If it IS who we think he is still a TOOL! If it isn't, how can he prove it?
Ray.
 
You guys are amazing! Why not PM me. I'll give you my phone number and you can give me a call. I am soooooo sick and tired of the paranoia around here. You guys must have been pretty beat up over the years.

Here's a start:

My name: Julius Tomsits thus the JT in jtgs850gl.
I live in Grayson GA 30017
My home number starts with 770 and my cell is 678

If you want the rest of the information you'll have to PM me to get it.

My guess is that the paranoia runs so deep that I will never see a PM or receive a call even if I do give it to you. Prove me wrong. I'd like to end this once and for all.
 
Silly me. I didn't see "electrical," just saw the title, and thought this was a white trash post about junk cars and overgrown grass.
 
Which reminds me..... the big wire from my batt neg terminates at one of the rear engine mount frame bolts. Far from ideal. The wire itself is not pretty and on occasion the starter spins slower than usual. Can any kind soul enlighten me as to where the earth point on top of the crankcase is supposed to be so I can string a proper starter earth. Too many dissimilar mating surfaces for my liking using the mount bolt route.
Probably fair to say that out of every hours riding that earth path is used very little and deficiencies are not as apparent.
 
It was good talking with you Julius. Hey guys, it is NOT Eric Bang in drag again! Just wanted any concerned to know.
Ray.
 
Brendan W said:
Which reminds me..... the big wire from my batt neg terminates at one of the rear engine mount frame bolts. Far from ideal. The wire itself is not pretty and on occasion the starter spins slower than usual. Can any kind soul enlighten me as to where the earth point on top of the crankcase is supposed to be so I can string a proper starter earth. Too many dissimilar mating surfaces for my liking using the mount bolt route.
Probably fair to say that out of every hours riding that earth path is used very little and deficiencies are not as apparent.
Click to expand...

The ground goes to a screw/bolt about center rear of the transmission case. Make sure the surface of the transmission case is clean as is the lug on the ground cable. I'll try to post a picture when I get home. I happen to have an engine out of the bike right now so it should be pretty easy to show where it goes.
 
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