Possible damaged R/R and/or stator

[noratx]

Hi,

I recently bought a GS 850 G -82 and the po said that I need to turn the light switch to OFF when parking to make sure the battery wont be discharged during night.

I have also found out that the battery doesnt charge when riding the bike.

I have not yet been able to test the stator or the R/R, but could any of those two, if damaged, be the cause for the battery drain? Or is it because of the headlight bypass that I have read about that should be done?

Id prefer not having to take out the whole loom if needed to search for gremlins... hence the question.

If the bypass or replacing stator and/or R/R does not help, I guess i will have to do that though.

Thanks!

/Rickard

 

[posplayr]

Your friend doesn't know what he is talking about. If you do have a short (draining the battery) it is not from the headlamp switch. That can only short if the engine is running.

Do the Quick Test in my signature.

IN ALL LIKELIHOOD YOU HAVE A COMBINATION OF PROBLEMS and guessing at what that is is a futile effort. Do the measurement and get to the bottom of the problem.

 

[tom203]

Unless the PO has done some creative wiring ( at fuse box maybe) headlight on/off should not be a battery drain- it's only powered when ignition is "on".

the r/r could be an issue no matter whether headlight switch is on or off.
Have you done this Quick Test?

http://www.thegsresources.com/_foru...System-QUICK-TEST/page2&p=1272192#post1272192

 

[noratx]

No friends in the calculation yet... only my thinking and trying to figure out what the cause for the battery drain could be.

I have read up on your quick test and thats what I will follow when I take the measurements during the coming weekend.

A fact is though, that if I dont turn the headlight switch to its off position, the battery DOES drain during night.
When in off position, the battery doesnt drain during nights.

 

[JTGS850GL]

To answer your original question; YES, a damaged R/R can cause excessive battery drain. If you system is not charging then please fix that first before you begin doing anything else. Perform the Quick Test as outlined in posplayr's signature and report back the results.

If you're concerned about the R/R and Stator draining your battery, then disconnect the R/R from your system by disconnecting the red wire (bullet connector) coming from it. That will effectively remove it from the system.

 

[noratx]

Thanks. Yeah, the quick test will be done during the comming weekend to decide wether I need a new regulator, stator or both.
I an not overly concerned about the battery drain, it is more of a thought than anything.
Fortunately I have another battery which I am charging externally to make sure if I one morning are left with a drained batery, I can quickly switch the battery so I can get to work.

However, I will try disconnect the bullet connector during one night, and leave the headlight switch on and see if that makes a difference or not.
If it does, I will take it as just another reason to get them replaced. (ofcourse not until I have determined by the quick test wether it's the stator or the R/R, so I don't go and buy new parts which I won't need in the end. Have done that moe than once and I'll be damned if I do it again!)

 

[posplayr]

To do the Quick Test you want the headlamp ON to do a reasonable battery load tests in the first two steps.

The R/R should be connected as well.

realize you will probably be rerunning this Quick Test as you check and change things.

 

[Brendan W]

With the ignition switch OFF the top three fuses should have no voltage.

 

[noratx]

Just one more question...

I know I should do the quicktest, and I will. I just dont have access to a mulimeter until the weekend, so I will do it then.
In the meanwhile I just have a lot of thoughts which I am hoping to get some help with.

I have been thinking thats its either the r/r or the stator that is at fault for not charging the battery, but...
Witj the battery fully charged (charged by an external charger) the bike performs well. The only exception being that the high beam drains the battery completely.

If the batteryis low charged, the bike still performs well.
Completely discharged and having had to be jumpstarted, the bike works but becomes sluggish and slow, and engine stalls if I dont keep the rpms at above 1100 rpm.

Wouldnt this suggest that the stator is ok, but the r/r is broken, since the stator gives enough power the ignition coils?

Now, i understand that no one can probably give a final answer, and that the only way to really know is to measure the output voltages from the stator. But am I even thinking right? Or is it just wishful thinking?

Also, I have seen a list of r/r's that have been tested from other bikes. I have an Kawasaki Z500 B3 from 1981 just standing around. Do you think the r/r from that bike could work on the GS850 G? I didnt see the r/r from this bike in the list at all, If you don't know, is there a way of finding out, except from simply just trying?

If I find after the quick test that I need a new r/r, and I do try it from the Z500, i will gladly submit my results to that list.

 

[posplayr]

In a pinch if you don't have a $3 meter, you can use one of these instead.

http://www.wikihow.com/Use-Dowsing-or-Divining-Rods

 

[noratx]

Posplayr: Am I misunderstanding you? Or did you just mean to try to be funny? If so, I didnt find it funny at all, rather more offending.

I don't have a $3 meter, because I have not been able to get hold of one. I need to order it from internet, which I have, but my friend who has one will be here with his faster (on saturday) than the delivery of the one I ordered (next week).

All I wanted was to have the thought of someone more experienced to see if I was thinking right at all, or if I was completely off the charts with my thinking. I guess I will just shut up and keep my questions to myself instead.

 

[Guest]

Posplayr: Am I misunderstanding you? Or did you just mean to try to be funny? If so, I didnt find it funny at all, rather more offending.

I don't have a $3 meter, because I have not been able to get hold of one. I need to order it from internet, which I have, but my friend who has one will be here with his faster (on saturday) than the delivery of the one I ordered (next week).

All I wanted was to have the thought of someone more experienced to see if I was thinking right at all, or if I was completely off the charts with my thinking. I guess I will just shut up and keep my questions to myself instead.

Don't mind posplayr
He was trying to be funny.
Get the meter and do the tests and get back to us.

 

[Rob S.]

...the stator or the R/R, but could any of those two, if damaged, be the cause for the battery drain?

Just so I'm straight on this (duh), if the stator isn't functioning, the battery won't charge (and therefore will drain)? Tell me I know at least that much.

Would it also be accurate to say the stator is just about the most expensive part that would cause charging failure?

 

[Guest]

Posplayr: Am I misunderstanding you? Or did you just mean to try to be funny? If so, I didnt find it funny at all, rather more offending.

I don't have a $3 meter, because I have not been able to get hold of one. I need to order it from internet, which I have, but my friend who has one will be here with his faster (on saturday) than the delivery of the one I ordered (next week).

All I wanted was to have the thought of someone more experienced to see if I was thinking right at all, or if I was completely off the charts with my thinking. I guess I will just shut up and keep my questions to myself instead.

Posplayr's point is that you are wasting your time with pointless speculation until you do the testing and have accurate information to work with. You list your location as Stockholm, is there not an auto parts store in that major city where you can buy a basic multimeter for a reasonable price instead of online ordering and waiting a week? As for whether it's the stator or regulator, it could be either or both or a combination of those along with corroded wiring connections. You don't need much power to the coils if everything else is decent, my 1100E shows 9.0V at the coils with a weak battery and it starts instantly cold or hot and runs very well, so even a stator on its way out could keep the bike running once it is going.


Mark

 

[noratx]

Thank you, the end of your reply was the kind of answer I was looking for. I dont ser it as pointless speculations, especially since I don't know enough to come to that conclusion myself.

I do live in Stockholm, indeed a major city, but in the outskirts. There are several reasons why I just dont get on the bus and go where I could pick up a decent multimeter, but none that I am willing to explain to people I dont know. There was a time when I was more open with it, sadly I have too often found people to be judgemental, so I stopped explaining my personal issues.

Anyways, I am often asking questions because I dont know but want to learn more. I have full understanding that many dont feel like answering stupid questions. I usually expect, when asking such questions, either silence, or straight answers.

I am a 'noob', especially when it comes to electrics, but as I said, i want to learn, but not by having people do what needs to be done for me.

Anyways, enough rambling from my part. I got the answer I needed. Next up, is following the guides to determine whats wrong.

I will return with my findings when this has been done
Cheers!

 

[Gorminrider]

noratx, you say,

Witj the battery fully charged (charged by an external charger) the bike performs well. The only exception being that the high beam drains the battery completely

.
This indicates the charging system is faulty. The charging system should "keep up" with the hi-beam unless you are idling at a stoplight for 45 minutes or so....

More, but just a speculation because the fault could be elsewhere (see below) it is an indication the stator has "lost a leg" and the output has been reduced....If this speculation is correct, then the stator is shorted OR possibly the problem lies in the infamous Suzuki stator-loop-to-headlight-switch circuit but I don't know if your 82? still has this without consulting your wiring diagram. Further, it's interesting that your light switch drains the battery when key is off, possibly relating to this infamous feature...
Indeed, electrical issues are very common. Easier for me and others is if you start reading some of posplayer's links and forum posts

 

[noratx]

I was a bit lucky.
The ordered voltmeter arrived earlier than expecten and i am just now in the garage following the guide.
Step 1 and 2 checks out perfectly.
The rest doesnt check at all.

Voltage stays steady at 12.56 v no matter if idle, at 1500 rpm or at 5000.

 

[Gorminrider]

Voltage stays steady at 12.56 v no matter if idle, at 1500 rpm or at 5000

points to a "lost" stator leg .Find the test for AC output of stator. If you get readings of 16-40 VAC = stator fault OR If your stator test comes up higher revisit my speculation per "headlight loop".
But my speculation is not the only possible cause by any means.
just to begin -Unsaid but always important- Closely inspect all connections for corrosion, heat damage and modification

 

[noratx]

Thank you.

Can I please ask you to clarify what it means that the stator has lost a leg?

I was trying to find the stator, and as far as I can see on any wiering diagrams, it should have 3 wires.
On the right hand side, just in front of the clutch, I can see a larger wire coming out. It leads to the left hand side sockets, and connects to a black socket on rhe rightmost side. (3 sockets in total, red, white and black). If i dont remember wrong, it connects to the socket and then going straight to the regulator. (I had to quickly finnish up and go back home, will go back later).

Only thing is, this larger wire contains 4 wires, not 3, so I am not sure this is the stator?
On the left hand side, I couldnt see or feel any wires coming out from the engine.

 

[noratx]

Nevermind, i see now when I loog at the diagram where I am misunderstanding how the wires are going.

Still though, I dont understand what it means that the stator has lost a leg?

Another question, is there a way to simply measure with the meter if the regulator needs to be replaced or not?